[openstack-dev] [all][tc] How to deal with confusion around "hosted projects"

Flavio Percoco flavio at redhat.com
Mon Jul 3 14:03:52 UTC 2017

On 28/06/17 16:50 -0500, Monty Taylor wrote:
>On 06/28/2017 09:50 AM, Thierry Carrez wrote:
>>Removing the root cause would be a more radical move: stop offering
>>hosting to non-OpenStack projects on OpenStack infrastructure
>>altogether. We originally did that for a reason, though. The benefits of
>>offering that service are:
>I disagree that this is removing the root cause.
>I believe this is reacting to a misunderstanding by hiding from it. I
>do not believe that doing this provides any value to us as a
>Even though we do not actually use github for development, we have
>implicitly accepted the false premise that github is a requirement. It
>is suggested that the existence of git repos in the openstack/ github
>org is confusing to people. And our reaction to that is to cut off
>access to our Open Source tools that we set up to collaboratively
>develop cloud software and tell people to go use the thing that people
>suggest is one of the causes of people being confused?
>* People are not 'confused' by what OpenStack is.
>Being "confused" is a passive-aggressive way of expressing that they
>DISAGREE with what OpenStack is. We still have _plenty_ of people who
>express that they think we should only be IaaS - so they're still
>going to be unhappy with cloudkitty, congress and karbor.
>Such people are under the misguided impression that kicking cloudkitty
>out of OpenStack will somehow cause Nova features to land quicker. I
>can't even begin to express all of the ways in which it's wrong. We
>aren't a top-down corporate structure and we can't 'reassign' humans -
>but even if we WERE - this flawed thinking runs afoul of the Mythical
>Man Month.

I agree with Monty on this one. My main concern with the proposal is that we'll
end up exactly where we are at now because we simply can't make everyone happy.
There are folks confused by what Google says (mainly people not familiar with
OpenStack) and there are folks confused because they disagree with what
OpenStack *is*.

As others proposed in this thread (or was it another thread?), I'd suggest we
first finish working on the vision, and take a few more steps on this area
before we do any other major change in the community. That way we can measure
whether the changes we're discussing serve such vision.


Flavio Percoco
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