[PTL][SIG] Virtual PTG Layout & Signup
Greetings! I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan! The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas). Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines. 1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first. 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions. Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible. We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier! Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event. If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help! Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg. -the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters) [1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 10:00, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote: [snip]
2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations.
April 6th is in the past so I suspect it is a typo. Do you mean April 16th? Cheers, gibi [snip]
Yes :) I did mean the 16th. No matter how many times you proof read something, things always fall through the cracks. Sorry! -Kendall (diablo_rojo) On Wed, Apr 15, 2020 at 12:54 AM Balázs Gibizer <balazs.gibizer@est.tech> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 10:00, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
[snip]
2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations.
April 6th is in the past so I suspect it is a typo. Do you mean April 16th?
Cheers, gibi
[snip]
It wasn't an RFE for a new OpenStack project codenamed TARDIS? ;-) On 4/15/20 10:31 AM, Kendall Nelson wrote:
Yes :) I did mean the 16th.
No matter how many times you proof read something, things always fall through the cracks.
Sorry!
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Wed, Apr 15, 2020 at 12:54 AM Balázs Gibizer <balazs.gibizer@est.tech> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 10:00, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com <mailto:kennelson11@gmail.com>> wrote:
[snip]
> 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April > 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the > scheduling of cross project conversations.
April 6th is in the past so I suspect it is a typo. Do you mean April 16th?
Cheers, gibi
[snip]
+2 If we got such a project to work we wouldn't need our day jobs anymore. :-) On 4/15/2020 11:17 AM, Ben Nemec wrote:
It wasn't an RFE for a new OpenStack project codenamed TARDIS? ;-)
On 4/15/20 10:31 AM, Kendall Nelson wrote:
Yes :) I did mean the 16th.
No matter how many times you proof read something, things always fall through the cracks.
Sorry!
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Wed, Apr 15, 2020 at 12:54 AM Balázs Gibizer <balazs.gibizer@est.tech> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 10:00, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com <mailto:kennelson11@gmail.com>> wrote:
[snip]
> 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April > 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the > scheduling of cross project conversations.
April 6th is in the past so I suspect it is a typo. Do you mean April 16th?
Cheers, gibi
[snip]
I thought we were focusing our other project energies on teleportation so we didn't need the metal tubes any longer? :) On Wed, Apr 15, 2020 at 10:45 AM Jay Bryant <jungleboyj@gmail.com> wrote:
+2
If we got such a project to work we wouldn't need our day jobs anymore. :-)
On 4/15/2020 11:17 AM, Ben Nemec wrote:
It wasn't an RFE for a new OpenStack project codenamed TARDIS? ;-)
On 4/15/20 10:31 AM, Kendall Nelson wrote:
Yes :) I did mean the 16th.
No matter how many times you proof read something, things always fall through the cracks.
Sorry!
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Wed, Apr 15, 2020 at 12:54 AM Balázs Gibizer <balazs.gibizer@est.tech> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 10:00, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com <mailto:kennelson11@gmail.com>> wrote:
[snip]
> 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April > 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the > scheduling of cross project conversations.
April 6th is in the past so I suspect it is a typo. Do you mean April 16th?
Cheers, gibi
[snip]
On 2020-04-15 15:32:07 -0700 (-0700), Julia Kreger wrote:
I thought we were focusing our other project energies on teleportation so we didn't need the metal tubes any longer? :) [...]
These days, holographic projection might be a more prudent technology to invest in. -- Jeremy Stanley
On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 18:03, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? The last time we doodled for kolla slots we ended up with 14:00 - 18:00 UTC, so I had proposed this to the team as a starting point but Pierre pointed out that it falls outside of the window.
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first. 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
[1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
On 2020-04-16 16:28:52 +0100 (+0100), Mark Goddard wrote: [...]
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? [...]
My understanding is that this was in part to simulate a "hallway track" by having common break times for all teams, but also by forcing some breaks between windows it both encourages teams to actually take breaks between adjacent slots, and makes it easier for teams to avoid overlap with related teams because their slots are all starting and ending at the same times. -- Jeremy Stanley
Hey Mark :) Part of it is breaks like Jeremy mentioned, but mostly its to give people a break to deal with any distractions (work, family, sleep, etc) and get other people tz wise involved. Each of the windows of times falls on a 'good' crossover time for two thirds of the world. Much further one direction or another and it gets really late or really early for one of those groups of people. On all three of the community brainstorming meetings there were ongoing concerns about anyone's ability to meet and stay engaged in a virtual meeting for more than 4 hours at a time as well. By capping the windows and forcing time in between them we are hoping to keep engagement high and reduce burnout and distraction. -Kendall (diablo_rojo) On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 8:29 AM Mark Goddard <mark@stackhpc.com> wrote:
On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 18:03, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we
are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We
set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? The last time we doodled for kolla slots we ended up with 14:00 - 18:00 UTC, so I had proposed this to the team as a starting point but Pierre pointed out that it falls outside of the window.
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign up
for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to
schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first.
2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
[1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
On Thu, 16 Apr 2020 at 17:53, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Mark :)
Part of it is breaks like Jeremy mentioned, but mostly its to give people a break to deal with any distractions (work, family, sleep, etc) and get other people tz wise involved. Each of the windows of times falls on a 'good' crossover time for two thirds of the world. Much further one direction or another and it gets really late or really early for one of those groups of people.
On all three of the community brainstorming meetings there were ongoing concerns about anyone's ability to meet and stay engaged in a virtual meeting for more than 4 hours at a time as well. By capping the windows and forcing time in between them we are hoping to keep engagement high and reduce burnout and distraction.
Thanks for the response. I'll update my proposed slots.
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 8:29 AM Mark Goddard <mark@stackhpc.com> wrote:
On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 18:03, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? The last time we doodled for kolla slots we ended up with 14:00 - 18:00 UTC, so I had proposed this to the team as a starting point but Pierre pointed out that it falls outside of the window.
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first. 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
[1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
On Thu, 2020-04-16 at 19:24 +0100, Mark Goddard wrote:
On Thu, 16 Apr 2020 at 17:53, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Mark :)
Part of it is breaks like Jeremy mentioned, but mostly its to give people a break to deal with any distractions (work, family, sleep, etc) and get other people tz wise involved. Each of the windows of times falls on a 'good' crossover time for two thirds of the world. Much further one direction or another and it gets really late or really early for one of those groups of people.
On all three of the community brainstorming meetings there were ongoing concerns about anyone's ability to meet and stay engaged in a virtual meeting for more than 4 hours at a time as well. By capping the windows and forcing time in between them we are hoping to keep engagement high and reduce burnout and distraction.
Thanks for the response. I'll update my proposed slots. by the way will these meeting slot get sent out as icals files that we can import like the openstack meetings page? i dont really mind creating them my self im just wondering if there is a plan to publish them automatically
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 8:29 AM Mark Goddard <mark@stackhpc.com> wrote:
On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 18:03, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? The last time we doodled for kolla slots we ended up with 14:00 - 18:00 UTC, so I had proposed this to the team as a starting point but Pierre pointed out that it falls outside of the window.
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first. 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
[1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
On 2020-04-16 20:31:31 +0100 (+0100), Sean Mooney wrote: [...]
by the way will these meeting slot get sent out as icals files that we can import like the openstack meetings page? i dont really mind creating them my self im just wondering if there is a plan to publish them automatically [...]
That might be trivial to add to https://opendev.org/openstack/ptgbot if someone feels like taking on a small hacking project. -- Jeremy Stanley
On Thu, 2020-04-16 at 19:35 +0000, Jeremy Stanley wrote:
On 2020-04-16 20:31:31 +0100 (+0100), Sean Mooney wrote: [...]
by the way will these meeting slot get sent out as icals files that we can import like the openstack meetings page? i dont really mind creating them my self im just wondering if there is a plan to publish them automatically
[...]
That might be trivial to add to https://opendev.org/openstack/ptgbot if someone feels like taking on a small hacking project.
ya so it looks like we can export the data in csv fromat via https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy.csv and https://pypi.org/project/ics/ is a thing so i might try hacking something together to do it. and assumign i can get that wroking then i can look a the ptg bot code later. if people added items to the sheet as "<project>: <topic>" e.g. "nova: retro" i could use that to group the generated icals into folder by project. similarly for sigs if you add "<group > SIG" i could match on that and put the seperatly. or cross-project: <project name> <project name> i could add it to both projects folders if the data is just free form and does not match the above huristic i could proably put it in an other folder. on the one hand i dont really want to impose any requiremnt on people but with a few simple conventions it would make automating this relitivly simple. i might play around with this and ill let people know if i get anything working. the other approch woudl be to convert each of the meeting slots to yaml files and use yaml2ical like the irc-meeting repo does https://opendev.org/opendev/irc-meetings/src/branch/master/tox.ini#L14-L23
On 2020-04-16 21:04:46 +0100 (+0100), Sean Mooney wrote: [...]
the other approch woudl be to convert each of the meeting slots to yaml files and use yaml2ical like the irc-meeting repo does [...]
We're going to need to import the data into ptgbot anyway, so maybe whatever serialization we use for that can also be used for earlier conversions to schedule files. -- Jeremy Stanley
On 4/16/20 3:35 PM, Jeremy Stanley wrote:
On 2020-04-16 21:04:46 +0100 (+0100), Sean Mooney wrote: [...]
the other approch woudl be to convert each of the meeting slots to yaml files and use yaml2ical like the irc-meeting repo does [...]
We're going to need to import the data into ptgbot anyway, so maybe whatever serialization we use for that can also be used for earlier conversions to schedule files.
We can probably take advantage of how we generate the ics files for the release schedule: https://opendev.org/openstack/releases/src/branch/master/doc/source/_exts/ic... https://opendev.org/openstack/releases/raw/branch/master/doc/source/ussuri/s...
On Thu, 2020-04-16 at 15:56 -0500, Sean McGinnis wrote:
On 4/16/20 3:35 PM, Jeremy Stanley wrote:
On 2020-04-16 21:04:46 +0100 (+0100), Sean Mooney wrote: [...]
the other approch woudl be to convert each of the meeting slots to yaml files and use yaml2ical like the irc-meeting repo does
[...]
We're going to need to import the data into ptgbot anyway, so maybe whatever serialization we use for that can also be used for earlier conversions to schedule files.
We can probably take advantage of how we generate the ics files for the release schedule:
https://opendev.org/openstack/releases/src/branch/master/doc/source/_exts/ic...
https://opendev.org/openstack/releases/raw/branch/master/doc/source/ussuri/s...
i decied to play with this and wrote https://github.com/SeanMooney/ptg-cal i have not bothered ading a cli or configuration althoguh i could add that later. it assumes the syntax i suggested either having <project>: <topic>, cross-project: <project> <project>... or SIG in the name if the ethercal is populated in that form it will preduce icals per room, per session and per tag, so it will create a tags/nova.ical that incluse all nova session but also tags/nova/<topic>.ical files for each sessions. not sure if it will be useful but it was fun to create. ill proably wrap it in a tox config so that its simple to run without needing to manually install it and the cople of deps that are needed.
I'm honestly a bit sad we still plan the virtual PTG event for a single week. This will be a very busy week with weird timeslots for most of us so our energy will mostly disappear after 2 days. Having slots around 2 weeks was helping the contributors to have enough time to rest between windows (compared to only a couple of hours which is meaningless in terms of real and factual rest) and this was basically discussed without strong objections during the first of the three open discussions we had. Is there any reasoning in terms of logistics or whatever else in sticking with such constrained and busy time window ? For large teams, could we maybe consider to run over those slots by organizing other meetings at other points in time (say, the week after) and if so, could the Foundation leave the infrastructure open for this ? Thanks, -Sylvain On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 7:05 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Mark :)
Part of it is breaks like Jeremy mentioned, but mostly its to give people a break to deal with any distractions (work, family, sleep, etc) and get other people tz wise involved. Each of the windows of times falls on a 'good' crossover time for two thirds of the world. Much further one direction or another and it gets really late or really early for one of those groups of people.
On all three of the community brainstorming meetings there were ongoing concerns about anyone's ability to meet and stay engaged in a virtual meeting for more than 4 hours at a time as well. By capping the windows and forcing time in between them we are hoping to keep engagement high and reduce burnout and distraction.
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 8:29 AM Mark Goddard <mark@stackhpc.com> wrote:
On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 18:03, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we
are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We
set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? The last time we doodled for kolla slots we ended up with 14:00 - 18:00 UTC, so I had proposed this to the team as a starting point but Pierre pointed out that it falls outside of the window.
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign
up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to
schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first.
2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
[1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
Hey Sylvain :) I don't think there is any reason why we *have* to restrict it to a week. That said, in the community brainstorming meetings there were requests for 'more than a day' and 'not more than a few days'. The natural balance then is a week? Are you assuming that you will *have* to attend all 8ish hours that fit your timezone? Depending on the teams that you participate in, I wouldn't think that you will have all 8 of those hours packed? There was also a concern during one of the meetings about getting 'buy-in' from management for more than a few days (or a week) being difficult. -Kendall (diablo_rojo) On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 12:46 PM Sylvain Bauza <sbauza@redhat.com> wrote:
I'm honestly a bit sad we still plan the virtual PTG event for a single week. This will be a very busy week with weird timeslots for most of us so our energy will mostly disappear after 2 days. Having slots around 2 weeks was helping the contributors to have enough time to rest between windows (compared to only a couple of hours which is meaningless in terms of real and factual rest) and this was basically discussed without strong objections during the first of the three open discussions we had.
Is there any reasoning in terms of logistics or whatever else in sticking with such constrained and busy time window ? For large teams, could we maybe consider to run over those slots by organizing other meetings at other points in time (say, the week after) and if so, could the Foundation leave the infrastructure open for this ?
Thanks, -Sylvain
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 7:05 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Mark :)
Part of it is breaks like Jeremy mentioned, but mostly its to give people a break to deal with any distractions (work, family, sleep, etc) and get other people tz wise involved. Each of the windows of times falls on a 'good' crossover time for two thirds of the world. Much further one direction or another and it gets really late or really early for one of those groups of people.
On all three of the community brainstorming meetings there were ongoing concerns about anyone's ability to meet and stay engaged in a virtual meeting for more than 4 hours at a time as well. By capping the windows and forcing time in between them we are hoping to keep engagement high and reduce burnout and distraction.
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 8:29 AM Mark Goddard <mark@stackhpc.com> wrote:
On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 18:03, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we
are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We
set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? The last time we doodled for kolla slots we ended up with 14:00 - 18:00 UTC, so I had proposed this to the team as a starting point but Pierre pointed out that it falls outside of the window.
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign
up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to
schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first.
2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
[1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 10:09 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Sylvain :)
I don't think there is any reason why we *have* to restrict it to a week. That said, in the community brainstorming meetings there were requests for 'more than a day' and 'not more than a few days'. The natural balance then is a week?
Are you assuming that you will *have* to attend all 8ish hours that fit your timezone? Depending on the teams that you participate in, I wouldn't think that you will have all 8 of those hours packed?
There was also a concern during one of the meetings about getting 'buy-in' from management for more than a few days (or a week) being difficult.
I do understand we somehow need to find a balance in between productivity, management and rest time. For this reason, I thought it was reasonable to have a 2-week PTG with free days between them so it was giving enough time for all contributors around the world to re-energize. See it as a 'dotted' PTG for people who prefer visual explanations. On the contrary, packing it all on a whole week will generate a lot of fatigue since people would potentially have to reproduce the same out-of-office-hours cadence every day. And this is very different from a jet lag fatigue. Either way, the ship has sailed, this e-mail is just me thinking I should have attended the brainstorming sessions more than once (but they were on out-of-office hours so i didn't, even if I wanted to. Just hoping people won't do the same for the PTG). -Sylvain -Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 12:46 PM Sylvain Bauza <sbauza@redhat.com> wrote:
I'm honestly a bit sad we still plan the virtual PTG event for a single week. This will be a very busy week with weird timeslots for most of us so our energy will mostly disappear after 2 days. Having slots around 2 weeks was helping the contributors to have enough time to rest between windows (compared to only a couple of hours which is meaningless in terms of real and factual rest) and this was basically discussed without strong objections during the first of the three open discussions we had.
Is there any reasoning in terms of logistics or whatever else in sticking with such constrained and busy time window ? For large teams, could we maybe consider to run over those slots by organizing other meetings at other points in time (say, the week after) and if so, could the Foundation leave the infrastructure open for this ?
Thanks, -Sylvain
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 7:05 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Mark :)
Part of it is breaks like Jeremy mentioned, but mostly its to give people a break to deal with any distractions (work, family, sleep, etc) and get other people tz wise involved. Each of the windows of times falls on a 'good' crossover time for two thirds of the world. Much further one direction or another and it gets really late or really early for one of those groups of people.
On all three of the community brainstorming meetings there were ongoing concerns about anyone's ability to meet and stay engaged in a virtual meeting for more than 4 hours at a time as well. By capping the windows and forcing time in between them we are hoping to keep engagement high and reduce burnout and distraction.
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Apr 16, 2020 at 8:29 AM Mark Goddard <mark@stackhpc.com> wrote:
On Tue, 14 Apr 2020 at 18:03, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we
are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5.
We set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Hi, just wondering what is the reasoning for having these windows, with gaps between them? The last time we doodled for kolla slots we ended up with 14:00 - 18:00 UTC, so I had proposed this to the team as a starting point but Pierre pointed out that it falls outside of the window.
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign
up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to
schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first.
2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
[1] https://ethercalc.openstack.org/126u8ek25noy [2] https://openstackfoundation.formstack.com/forms/june2020_virtual_ptg_survey
On Tue, Apr 14, 2020 at 1:13 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Greetings!
I am sure you have all been anxiously awaiting more details on how we are going to virtualize the PTG :) After the community meetings we had last week/the week before to understand the key challenges and ideate on solutions, we have a plan!
The virtual event will be held from Monday June 1 to Friday June 5. We set up available times in 3 different time windows where each window is a cross over time between at least 2 regions (Window A - Americas/Europe, Window B - Europe/APAC, and Window C - APAC/Americas).
Here is an ethercalc[1]. We ask that the PTL/SIG Chair/Team lead sign up for time to have their discussions in with 4 rules/guidelines.
1. Cross project discussions (i.e. SIGs and horizonal teams), try to schedule yourselves towards the start of the week so that any discussions that might shape those of vertical teams might happen first. 2. Vertical teams (ex. Nova, Cyborg, Manila) should wait till April 6th at 7:00 UTC to start signing up for slots to help prioritize the scheduling of cross project conversations. 3. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 4 hours per UTC day to help keep participants actively engaged. 4. No team (SIG, horizonal project, vertical project, etc) can sign up for more than 16 hours across all time slots to avoid burning out our contributors and to enable participation in multiple teams discussions.
Once every team has had a chance to sign up (lets say two weeks from today April 28th at 7:00 UTC) if signing up for more time makes sense, it will be possible.
We want to encourage ANY team to sign up, even those that had originally said no to the initial outreach when the PTG was supposed to be in person. The more the merrier!
Once you have signed up for time slots, please also fill out this survey[2] with your team information. We need this additional information to help shape other decisions down the road and coordinate other details closer to the event.
If you have any issues with signing up your team, due to conflict or otherwise, please let me know! While we are trying to empower you to make your own decisions as to when you meet and for how long (after all, you know your needs and teams timezones better than we do), we are here to help!
Continue to check back for updates at openstack.org/ptg.
-the Kendalls (diablo_rojo & wendallkaters)
This is a great plan, in my opinion. I read the concerns from Sylvain and I feel like that it's up to the teams if they decide to extend it to one more week. Making people overwhelmed is definitely not a goal here, especially at this time. I think the challenges here are the following: - Give an opportunity to *everyone* wherever the timezone is to participate at some point. - Wisely use our tooling to organize the meetings, capture notes, share the outputs and involve people so consensus can be reached / information can be shared. - Keep people engaged "virtually" as they would be in-person, physically. - Accept that this is our first time and it'll be a good exercise for everyone to learn from this event and probably do better the next time. I liked the time windows as it really allows anyone to participate; this isn't perfect and won't be as cool as everyone being in a room; however we have to acknowledge the potential benefits: get more contributors (think about those who could never travel); keep demonstrating that our community is able to work remotely and finally I expect more notes and etherpads than ever which will be good to keep track on what we do and where we are in OpenStack. Looking forward to participating! -- Emilien Macchi
participants (11)
-
Balázs Gibizer
-
Ben Nemec
-
Emilien Macchi
-
Jay Bryant
-
Jeremy Stanley
-
Julia Kreger
-
Kendall Nelson
-
Mark Goddard
-
Sean McGinnis
-
Sean Mooney
-
Sylvain Bauza