[Openstack-operators] Packaging discussion (and anvil)

Tom Fifield tom at openstack.org
Wed Mar 12 05:06:17 UTC 2014

Hi all,

Thanks for starting the thread Josh - you're too fast ;)

Just to fill in some more information from the day...

Recently, we got about 50 people together who are all running OpenStack 
clouds to have a bit of a rant session. The very first thing that came 
up was: packaging.

It turns out that:
1) the majority of people in that room (who are running production 
clouds) are making their own custom packages for at least some components

2) People package for different reasons, eg they:
* need isolation of virtual environments - different versions of 
openstack services on the one machine
* want to incorporate features from a newer version
* need to fix bugs
* find the lag time between bug fix and fix appearing in upstream distro 
repo is too long, so patch locally carry it in-house until then
* need vendor-fixed drivers that are not yet part of upstream
* don't find the quality or consistency of upstream packages to be 
* find that upstream dependencies break things
* discovered that some packages assume internet access is available, 
when it is not
* have their own custom additions
* are doing continuous deployment

3) People are using either upstream source or distro packages as a 
source for their custom packages

4) Most people are not packaging other software, just OpenStack

5) Many people believe that OpenStack will not get the the stage (at 
least for a long time) where they can just use upstream packages, 
because OpenStack has a high level of innovation and change and it's a 
complicated, distributed service.

Throughout all of this, quite a few different toolchains have been 
developed for packaging OpenStack in various environments. So, I think, 
given that so many people are packaging...

==> we need to form a community around making it really easy to make 
custom packages of OpenStack bits

If you agree, it would be great if we could get you and others together 
to have a chat about what's out there right now, potentially improve 
them, and leave some brilliantly coloured flags (possibly in the form of 
docs/tutorials/rants) for the ops guys that follow us :) On the day we 
had a couple of people volunteer to kick this effort of, so I'll let 
them jump in and take control!



On 06/03/14 04:54, Joshua Harlow wrote:
> Hi all,
> At the operators summit etherpad[1] I saw some discussion about packaging.
> Since I'm currently hosting
> https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-icehouse-sprint I wasn't able to
> attend (sorry).
> But I did leave some comments about what anvil[2] is doing related to
> packaging.
> I was wondering if there is enough interest to hear more about what its
> doing in more depth (and have a Q/A...)?
> Potentially something on hangouts or elsewhere?
> Let me know :-)
> -Josh
> [1] https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/operators-feedback-mar14
> [2] http://anvil.readthedocs.org/en/latest/
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> OpenStack-operators at lists.openstack.org
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