Open Stack

Doug Hellmann wrote on 3/7/2017 12:53 AM:
> Excerpts from Sean Dague's message of 2017-03-06 09:06:18 -0500:
>> On 03/06/2017 08:43 AM, Andreas Jaeger wrote:
>>> On 2017-03-06 14:03, Sean Dague  wrote:
>>>> I'm trying to understand the implications of
>>>> https://review.openstack.org/#/c/439500. And the comment in the linked
>>>> email:
>>>>
>>>> ">> Yes, we decided some time ago to not translate the log files anymore and
>>>>>> thus our tools do not handle them anymore - and in general, we remove
>>>>>> these kind of files."
>>>> Does that mean that all the _LE, _LI, _LW stuff in projects should be
>>>> fully removed? Nova currently enforces those things are there -
>>>> https://github.com/openstack/nova/blob/e88dd0034b1b135d680dae3494597e295add9cfe/nova/hacking/checks.py#L314-L333
>>>> and want to make sure our tools aren't making us do work that the i18n
>>>> team is ignoring and throwing away.
>>> Sean, this was removed as followup to:
>>>
>>> http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-i18n/2016-November/002574.html
>>>
>>> Let me copy Ian as i18n PTL,
>>>
>>> Andreas
>> That all seems reasonable, and I'm happy to follow the i18n team's lead
>> here. It is however a significant reversal of policy, and there is
>> substantial code infrastructure in projects (like Nova) to support the
>> old policy.
>>
>> So if this is new policy, a much wider dissemination of it would be
>> welcomed, as it means we can purge this infrastructure from projects
>> like Nova.
>>
>>      -Sean
>>
> Yes, we went to a great deal of trouble to enable log translations,
> so I'm surprised to see it being dropped to quickly.  I don't
> necessarily disagree with the decision, because I know translator
> time is limited. But it would be nice to have the discussion here,

+1 and for such discussions including openstack-i18n at lists.openstack.org 
mailing list would be also nice :)

On Barcelona Design Summit, there were I18n contributor meetup and I18n 
team members discussed a lot.
One of things was not to translate log-level strings for server projects.

Note that such decision was made not because translator time is limited.

Log messages are important to better identify which errors are being 
posed and most operators (+ developers)
diagnose and start to solve error situations from the log messages.
I18n team previously translated log messages a lot especially thanks to 
translation contribution from IBM. (AFAIK)
However, after then, there have been some voices - why I18n team 
translated log messages?
After listening to the voices in details, I18n team identified that the 
background of such voices was related with searching log messages on 
Internet.
Searching English log messages on the Internet will retrieve more number 
of results than searching translated log messages on the Internet.

Translating log messages now has two different point of views:
  - Will be useful for OpenStack users to better understand log messages 
in details with translated log messages?
  - Or will not be useful for OpenStack users because the original log 
messages will have better chance to find solutions who occurred the 
similar cases on the Internet?

I18n team discussed with such point of views and on Barcelona Summit the 
latter point would be more important than the former point.
Also, it would be just a point of view from PTL, but it is difficult for 
me to encourage to contribution translations which have such kind of 
controversy.

Now I would like to listen again to not only developers, but also 
operators and translators - for log string translation.
If someone thinks that the former point would be more important than the 
latter point, please share through this mailing list to reconsider the 
current decision.


With many thanks,

/Ian

> instead of on a list most of the community isn't subscribed to, so
> everyone involved can understand the reason for the change and so
> the folks who asked for it originally can be included in the
> conversation. As Sean points out, the policy change has a lot of
> other implications about how logging is handled throughout the
> applications.
>
> Doug
>
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