Open Stack

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 5:48 PM Alex Schultz <aschultz at redhat.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 9:30 AM Ghanshyam Mann <gmann at ghanshyammann.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >  ---- On Wed, 01 Dec 2021 09:13:02 -0600 Zane Bitter <zbitter at redhat.com>
> wrote ----
> >  > On 26/11/21 10:29, Ghanshyam Mann wrote:
> >  > >   ---- On Fri, 26 Nov 2021 09:20:39 -0600 Dmitry Tantsur <
> dtantsur at redhat.com> wrote ----
> >  > >   >
> >  > >   >
> >  > >   > On Fri, Nov 26, 2021 at 3:35 PM Jeremy Stanley <
> fungi at yuggoth.org> wrote:
> >  > >   > On 2021-11-26 14:29:53 +0100 (+0100), Dmitry Tantsur wrote:
> >  > >   > [...]
> >  > >   > > CentOS/RHEL ships 3.6 and a limited version of 3.8 and 3.9.
> >  > >   > [...]
> >  > >   >
> >  > >   > Is this still true for CentOS Stream 9? The TC decision was to
> >  > >   > support that instead of CentOS Stream 8 in Yoga.
> >  > >   >
> >  > >   > No. But Stream 9 is pretty much beta, so it's not a replacement
> for us (and we don't have nodes in nodepool with it even yet?).
> >  > >
> >  > > I think here is the confusion. In TC, after checking with centos
> team impression was CentOS stream 9 is released and that is
> >  > > what we should update In OpenStack testing. And then only we
> updated the centos stream 8 -> 9 and dropped py3.6 testing
> >  > >
> >  > > -
> https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/governance/+/815851/3..6/reference/runtimes/yoga.rst
> >  >
> >  > The guidelines the TC have set are not that something exists, but that
> >  > it is a stable LTS release. Debian sid, Ubuntu 20.10, Fedora rawhide,
> >  > and OpenSUSE Tumbleweed all exist, but nobody mistakes them for stable
> >  > LTS releases. It's not clear to me why CentOS Stream is the only
> distro
> >  > being treated differently.
> >  >
> >  > The only difference is there is no plan for a CentOS-branded release
> to
> >  > define a point in time where Stream 9 becomes an LTS release. However,
> >  > other parties do have such plans, but pointedly have not done so:
> RHEL9
> >  > is in beta; Rocky Linux, Alma Linux, and Oracle Linux are all yet to
> >  > release a version based on Stream 9.
> >  >
> >  > Presumably RDO folks were consulted about this decision and were OK
> with
> >  > the time frame. However, there are other users out there, and from a
> >  > Metal³ perspective this is a giant PITA, requiring us to move from a
> LTS
> >  > distro to a beta one, that was dropped on us in the middle of a
> release
> >  > cycle in flagrant violation of the TC's own guidelines that the stable
> >  > distibutions must be chosen from among those available at the
> >  > *beginning* of the release cycle (which CentOS Stream 9 was not).
> >
> > Those are good points. We were discussing with the RDO team on the start
> > of Yoga cycle itself whether to move to CentOS Stream9  or not.
> >
> > Yes, there is a clear confusion on what is stable or not in CentOS
> Stream distro.
> > Like other distro has, is there any document we as TC can refer to in
> the future on
> > checking if the CentOS Stream *X* version is stable/LTS or not? I cannot
> find it
> > for CentOS Stream 8 also, is that stable or LTS?
> >
>
> I guess what's the definition of LTS? Support > 1 year?
>
> https://www.centos.org/cl-vs-cs/
>
> CentOS Stream 8 is to be supported till 2024 and 9 is estimated until
> 2027. That seems pretty LTS to me.
>
>
Actually, there are no special LTS releases in CentOS. In Red Hat family
distros, Fedora would be the non-LTS distro while CentOS is the LTS one.


> Additionally what is the definition of stable in this case? My
> understanding is that there still won't be major version bumps to core
> software similar to how CentOS used to operate.  So it'd be a similar
> stability as previously existed in the non stream 7/8. What changes is
> that fixes will be available sooner, but it would have been the same
> that would have been released at a previous point release in the old
> method.
>
>
Exactly, so as mentioned several times in this thread the main difference
between CentOS Stream and CentOS Linux is the fact that updates are not
done in big batches (minor releases) but in more frequent and small package
updates in a continuous delivery approach [1]. Stability should not be very
different to what we had with CentOS Linux.

[1] https://blog.centos.org/2020/12/centos-stream-is-continuous-delivery/



> > If we have such official documentation or announcement  in RDO community
> > then we can avoid such situations in future where we get to know the
> distro
> > version stability well before trying it in OpenStack testing?
> >
> > - https://centos.org/download/
> >
> > -gmann
> >
> >  >
> >  > cheers,
> >  > Zane.
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >
>
>
>
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