Open Stack

Having my FC SIG hat on: To summarize about having the 'Help wanted list' under FC SIG, we discussed that in FC meeting this week[1] and planned to have it under TC as first option and if there is no candidate to own it then we re-discuss it to have under FC SIG. 

After seeing reply from ttx and IRC chat, it seems we are going to give it another chance under TC. So FC SIG is all ok to help/advertise or direct new contributor to that list or contact owner. 

Having my TC hat on: I agree with ttx idea of 1:1 mapping and I feel that is much needed to make it a success. But please choose some simple name so that people do not need to search or have a hard time to understand it :). Help/Mentor/Pending/Volunteer can be very simple word to understand it. 

As ttx mentioned about next step, I am listing it in more detail:
- Have template to request the items to be added in this list.  I prefer it via gerrit and TC review that and approve accordingly. 
- Add Job Description section also in that list which can vary in term or skill needed per item. lance already started that - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/637025/1
- Clean up the old list and ask for a new list from the community. Or ask old list requester to continue or re-submit the request.  
- Assign a TC member as Owner to this work. 

[1] http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-meeting/%23openstack-meeting.2019-02-13.log.html#t2019-02-13T07:23:06

-gmann


 ---- On Fri, 15 Feb 2019 03:51:19 +0900 Lance Bragstad <lbragstad at gmail.com> wrote ---- 
 >            Updating the thread since we talked about this         quite a bit in the -tc channel, too [0] (sorry for duplicating         across communication mediums!)
 >          
 >          TL;DR the usefulness of job descriptions is still a thing. To         kick start that, I proposed an example to the current help         wanted list to kick start what we want our "job descriptions" to         look like [1], if we were to have them.
 >          
 >          [0] http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/irclogs/%23openstack-tc/%23openstack-tc.2019-02-14.log.html#t2019-02-14T16:53:55
 >          [1] https://review.openstack.org/#/c/637025/
 >        
 >      On 2/14/19 7:29 AM, Thierry Carrez       wrote:
 >           Colleen       Murphy wrote:       
 >        I feel like there is a bit of a disconnect         between what the TC is asking for         
 >          and what the current mentoring organizations are designed to         provide. Thierry         
 >          framed this as a "peer-mentoring offered" list, but mentoring         doesn't quite         
 >          capture everything that's needed.         
 >          
 >          Mentorship programs like Outreachy, cohort mentoring, and the         First Contact SIG         
 >          are oriented around helping new people quickstart into the         community, getting         
 >          them up to speed on basics and helping them feel good about         themselves and         
 >          their contributions. The hope is that happy first-timers         eventually become         
 >          happy regular contributors which will eventually be a benefit to         the projects,         
 >          but the benefit to the projects is not the main focus.         
 >          
 >          The way I see it, the TC Help Wanted list, as well as the new         thing, is not         
 >          necessarily oriented around newcomers but is instead advocating         for the         
 >          projects and meant to help project teams thrive by getting         committed long-term         
 >          maintainers involved and invested in solving longstanding         technical debt that         
 >          in some cases requires deep tribal knowledge to solve. It's not         a thing for a         
 >          newbie to step into lightly and it's not something that can be         solved by a         
 >          FC-liaison pointing at the contributor docs. Instead what's         needed are mentors         
 >          who are willing to walk through that tribal knowledge with a new         contributor         
 >          until they are equipped enough to help with the harder problems.         
 >          
 >          For that reason I think neither the FC SIG or the mentoring         cohort group, in         
 >          their current incarnations, are the right groups to be managing         this. The FC         
 >          SIG's mission is "To provide a place for new contributors to         come for         
 >          information and advice" which does not fit the long-term goal of         the help         
 >          wanted list, and cohort mentoring's four topics ("your first         patch", "first         
 >          CFP", "first Cloud", and "COA"[1]) also don't fit with the         long-term and deeply         
 >          technical requirements that a project-specific mentorship         offering needs.         
 >          Either of those groups could be rescoped to fit with this new         mission, and         
 >          there is certainly a lot of overlap, but my feeling is that this         needs to be an         
 >          effort conducted by the TC because the TC is the group that         advocates for the         
 >          projects.         
 >          
 >          It's moreover not a thing that can be solved by another list of         names. In addition         
 >          to naming someone willing to do the several hours per week of         mentoring,         
 >          project teams that want help should be forced to come up with a         specific         
 >          description of 1) what the project is, 2) what kind of person         (experience or         
 >          interests) would be a good fit for the project, 3) specific work         items with         
 >          completion criteria that needs to be done - and it can be         extremely challenging         
 >          to reframe a project's longstanding issues in such concrete ways         that make it         
 >          clear what steps are needed to tackle the problem. It should         basically be an         
 >          advertisement that makes the project sound interesting and         challenging and         
 >          do-able, because the current help-wanted list and liaison lists         and mentoring         
 >          topics are too vague to entice anyone to step up.         
 >               
 >        Well said. I think we need to use another term for this program,       to avoid colliding with other forms of mentoring or on-boarding       help.       
 >        
 >        On the #openstack-tc channel, I half-jokingly suggested to call       this the 'Padawan' program, but now that I'm sober, I feel like it       might actually capture what we are trying to do here:       
 >        
 >        - Padawans are 1:1 trained by a dedicated, experienced team member       
 >        - Padawans feel the Force, they just need help and perspective to       master it       
 >        - Padawans ultimately join the team* and may have a padawan of       their own       
 >        - Bonus geek credit for using Star Wars references       
 >        
 >        * unless they turn to the Dark Side, always a possibility       
 >        
 >        Finally, I rather disagree that this         should be something maintained as a page in         
 >          individual projects' contributor guides, although we should         certainly be         
 >          encouraging teams to keep those guides up to date. It should be         compiled by the         
 >          TC and regularly updated by the project liaisons within the TC.         A link to a         
 >          contributor guide on docs.openstack.org doesn't give anyone an         idea of what         
 >          projects need the most help nor does it empower people to         believe they can help         
 >          by giving them an understanding of what the "job" entails.         
 >               
 >        I think we need a single list. I guess it could be sourced from       several repositories, but at least for the start I would not       over-engineer it, just put it out there as a replacement for the       help-most-needed list and see if it flies.       
 >        
 >        As a next step, I propose to document the concept on a TC page,       then reach out to the currently-listed teams on help-most-wanted       to see if there would be a volunteer interested in offering       Padawan training and bootstrap the new list, before we start to       promote it more actively.       
 >        
 >           
 >