Open Stack

Hi,

Yes, https://github.com/State-of-the-Edge/glossary is a good initiative. Maybe we should all just start using the terms defined there and contribute if we have problems with the definitions.

Br,
Gerg0

From: Teresa Peluso <tpeluso at equinix.com>
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2018 4:39 PM
To: Csatari, Gergely (Nokia - HU/Budapest) <gergely.csatari at nokia.com>; OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) <openstack-dev at lists.openstack.org>; fulton at redhat.com; edge-computing at lists.openstack.org
Cc: openstack-sigs at lists.openstack.org
Subject: RE: [openstack-dev] [Openstack-sigs] [FEMDC] [Edge] [tripleo] On the use of terms "Edge" and "Far Edge"

Fyi – could this help?  https://www.linuxfoundation.org/blog/2018/06/edge-computing-just-got-its-rosetta-stone/

https://imasons.org/ starting to host workshops about this as well https://imasons.org/events/2018-im-edge-congress/

From: Csatari, Gergely (Nokia - HU/Budapest) <gergely.csatari at nokia.com<mailto:gergely.csatari at nokia.com>>
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2018 1:05 AM
To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) <openstack-dev at lists.openstack.org<mailto:openstack-dev at lists.openstack.org>>; fulton at redhat.com<mailto:fulton at redhat.com>; edge-computing at lists.openstack.org<mailto:edge-computing at lists.openstack.org>
Cc: openstack-sigs at lists.openstack.org<mailto:openstack-sigs at lists.openstack.org>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [Edge-computing] [openstack-dev] [Openstack-sigs] [FEMDC] [Edge] [tripleo] On the use of terms "Edge" and "Far Edge"

Hi,

I’m adding the ECG mailing list to the discussion.

I think the root of the problem is that there is no single definition of „the edge” (except for [1<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_The-5FEdge&d=DwMGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=J6lr_T9m7mkisVR7l1QzmBki20r5He3fuZXvbYg-EPs&e=>]), but it changes from group to group or use case to use case. What I recognise as the commonalities in these edge definitions, are 1) a distributed cloud infrastructure (kind of a cloud of clouds) 2) need for automation or everything 3) resource constraints for the control plane.

The different edge variants are putting different emphasis on these common needs based ont he use case discussed.

To have a more clear understanding of these definitions we could try the following:

  1.  Always add the definition of these to the given context
  2.  Check what other groups are using and adopt to that
  3.  Define our own language and expect everyone else to adopt

Br,
Gerg0



[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Edge<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_The-5FEdge&d=DwQGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=J6lr_T9m7mkisVR7l1QzmBki20r5He3fuZXvbYg-EPs&e=>

From: Jim Rollenhagen <jim at jimrollenhagen.com<mailto:jim at jimrollenhagen.com>>
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2018 11:43 PM
To: fulton at redhat.com<mailto:fulton at redhat.com>; OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions) <openstack-dev at lists.openstack.org<mailto:openstack-dev at lists.openstack.org>>
Cc: openstack-sigs at lists.openstack.org<mailto:openstack-sigs at lists.openstack.org>
Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [Openstack-sigs] [FEMDC] [Edge] [tripleo] On the use of terms "Edge" and "Far Edge"

On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 4:45 PM John Fulton <johfulto at redhat.com<mailto:johfulto at redhat.com>> wrote:
On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 11:56 AM Jim Rollenhagen <jim at jimrollenhagen.com<mailto:jim at jimrollenhagen.com>> wrote:
>
> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 10:23 AM Dmitry Tantsur <dtantsur at redhat.com<mailto:dtantsur at redhat.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Sorry for chiming in really late in this topic, but I think $subj is worth
>> discussing until we settle harder on the potentially confusing terminology.
>>
>> I think the difference between "Edge" and "Far Edge" is too vague to use these
>> terms in practice. Think about the "edge" metaphor itself: something rarely has
>> several layers of edges. A knife has an edge, there are no far edges. I imagine
>> zooming in and seeing more edges at the edge, and then it's quite cool indeed,
>> but is it really a useful metaphor for those who never used a strong microscope? :)
>>
>> I think in the trivial sense "Far Edge" is a tautology, and should be avoided.
>> As a weak proof of my words, I already see a lot of smart people confusing these
>> two and actually use Central/Edge where they mean Edge/Far Edge. I suggest we
>> adopt a different terminology, even if it less consistent with typical marketing
>> term around the "Edge" movement.
>
>
> FWIW, we created rough definitions of "edge" and "far edge" during the edge WG session in Denver.
> It's mostly based on latency to the end user, though we also talked about quantities of compute resources, if someone can find the pictures.

Perhaps these are the pictures Jim was referring to?
 https://www.dropbox.com/s/255x1cao14taer3/MVP-Architecture_edge-computing_PTG.pptx?dl=0#<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.dropbox.com_s_255x1cao14taer3_MVP-2DArchitecture-5Fedge-2Dcomputing-5FPTG.pptx-3Fdl-3D0&d=DwMGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=Zh9LBq_sTlZxC5xI7FupdttxdRrhrwmoIsY4eZRlvjM&e=>

That's it, thank you!

// jim



I'm involved in some TripleO work called the split control plane:
  https://specs.openstack.org/openstack/tripleo-specs/specs/rocky/split-controlplane.html<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__specs.openstack.org_openstack_tripleo-2Dspecs_specs_rocky_split-2Dcontrolplane.html&d=DwMGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=tuDTh6QOmYEza4K8a7S2RoUpc1ttgBTHVC8re5vfcdg&e=>

After the PTG I saw that the split control plane was compatible with
the type of deployment discussed at the edge WG session in Denver and
described the compatibility at:
  https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-edge-working-group-split-control-plane<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__etherpad.openstack.org_p_tripleo-2Dedge-2Dworking-2Dgroup-2Dsplit-2Dcontrol-2Dplane&d=DwMGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=5Ak84Rb4c98_jEqNWjvWYCeVAN0XkbZzdXVWax9oo_Q&e=>

> See the picture and table here: https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Edge_Computing_Group/Edge_Reference_Architectures#Overview<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__wiki.openstack.org_wiki_Edge-5FComputing-5FGroup_Edge-5FReference-5FArchitectures-23Overview&d=DwMGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=yqEH7weN-I2YvoYDRi6nSWGtNzQsX-HfBieGuOBow1M&e=>
>
>> Now, I don't have really great suggestions. Something that came up in TripleO
>> discussions [1] is Core/Hub/Edge, which I think reflects the idea better.
>
>
> I'm also fine with these names, as they do describe the concepts well. :)
>
> // jim

I'm fine with these terms too. In split control plane there's a
deployment method for deploying a central site and then deploying
remote sites independently. That deployment method could be used to
deploy  Core/Hub/Edge sites too. E.g. deploy the Core using Heat stack
N. Deploy a Hub using stack N+1 and then deploy an Edge using stack
N+2 etc.

  John

>>
>> I'd be very interested to hear your ideas.
>>
>> Dmitry
>>
>> [1] https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/tripleo-edge-mvp<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__etherpad.openstack.org_p_tripleo-2Dedge-2Dmvp&d=DwMGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=XI1J9s1i2KxUSnOX9Yk3XQ_5kH08UoWZ_uqd6Y3efQU&e=>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> openstack-sigs mailing list
>> openstack-sigs at lists.openstack.org<mailto:openstack-sigs at lists.openstack.org>
>> http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-sigs<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.openstack.org_cgi-2Dbin_mailman_listinfo_openstack-2Dsigs&d=DwMGaQ&c=gxW9PgscCAGwFImBgfkGkoANogu61GVPNv0sglxAtik&r=JcbYkw8s_8JtubERIbsy_0Qc_q0zGK9nUrtf2IWVNmQ&m=VtNo9cSRcnVhW9PH68IA26gNRrJ96V0O7MHTeONQ-hY&s=TmAFzLOVMjHTW569gUKwSRI4OwLlF5tOqAlcYuPaCHM&e=>
>
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