[openstack-dev] [kolla][fuel][tripleo] Reference architecture to deploy OpenStack on k8s

Flavio Percoco flavio at redhat.com
Tue Sep 27 08:12:28 UTC 2016


On 23/09/16 12:33 -0400, Ryan Hallisey wrote:
>Thanks for starting the discussion Fabio.
>
>> As someone that started looking into this topic just recently, I'd love to see
>> our communities collaborate more wherever possible. For example, it'd be great
>> to see us working on a reference architecture for deploying OpenStack on
>> kubernetes, letting the implementation details aside for a bit. I'd assume some
>> folks have done this already and I bet we can all learn more from it if we work
>> on this together.
>
>Agreed Flavio. Members of the kolla-kubernetes community have some ideas of
>how this will look.  I can put together some diagrams over the weekend to depict
>this and maybe others that have some ideas can comment and share theirs.

Sounds awesome! Thanks a bunch :)

>> So, let me go ahead and ask some further questions here, I might be missing some
>> history and/or context:
>> - Is there any public documentation that acts as a reference architecture for
>>  deploying OpenStack on kubernetes?
>
>These specs [1][2] might be a good start.

I'll go through these, thanks.

>> - Is this something the architecture working group could help with? Or would it
>>  be better to hijack one of kolla meetings?
>
>kolla-kubernetes has a booked slot in the weekly kolla meetings. This could be
>discussed there.

++

>>> So issue is, I know of few other openstacks on k8s and everyone does
>>> that slightly differently. So far we lack proof points and real world
>>> data to determine best approaches to stuff. This is still not-to-well
>>> researched field. Right now it's mostly opinions and assumptions.
>>> We're not ready to make document without having a flame war around
>>> it;) Not enough knowledge in our collective brains.
>
>> Awesome input, thanks.
>
>Michal is right, there are a bunch of implementations that exist. The tricky
>part is pulling together all the groups to figure out the best solution.
>
>When the kolla-kubernetes project was created, my hope that this new repo would
>be a place where anyone curious about the OpenStack and Kubernetes interaction
>could come and express their opinion in code or conversation. The community still
>remains open to any changes with it's implementation and the current
>implementation is a reflection of who is participating.
>
>I agree that it would be ideal for a single place to collaborate. It would be
>awesome to bring together the community that is looking to solve this
>problem around a single project. Doesn't matter what that project is, but I'd
>like for more collaboration :).
>
>>> As for Kolla-k8s we are still deep in development, so we are free to
>>> take best course of action we know of. We don't have any technical
>>> debt now. Current state of stuff represents what we thing is best
>>> approach.
>
>> I wonder if we can start writing these assumptions down and update them as we
>> go. I don't expect you to do it, I'm happy to help with this. We could put it in
>> kolla-k8s docs if that makes sense to other kolla-k8s folks.
>
>It's not that Kolla-k8s has tech debt, but rather the community is still testing the
>waters with its implementation. For instance, the community is looking at a workflow
>that will execute the deployment of OpenStack and hand off to Kubernetes to manage it.
>This solution raises some questions: why do you need a workflow at all? Why not
>use Kubernetes, a Container Orchestration Engine, to orchestrate the services?  A lot
>of these fundamental questions were outlined in this spec [1] and the answers to them
>are still WIP [3].

Indeed! This and other fundamental questions are the ones I'd like us to answer
and document, perhaps as new things happen. I'll read [3] too. Thanks for the
pointer.

>> I'll probably start pinging you guys on IRC with questions so I can help writing
>> this down.
>
>That would be fantastic! There's also room for collaboration at summit too.
>Kolla-kubernetes will have a design session/fishbowl scheduled.

Awesome! I'll be there for sure :)

>>> There is also part that k8s is constantly growing and it lacks certain
>>> features that created these issues in the first place, if k8s solves
>>> them on their side, that will affect decision on our side.
>
>> Thanks a lot, Michal. This is indeed the kind of info I was looking for and
>> where I'd love to start from.
>
>Agreed Michal.  The community has been adapting on the fly based on features coming
>out of Kubernetes.  Things like init containers and petsets were recent features
>that have found their way into kolla-kubernetes.
>
>The flow of work in kolla-kubernetes has been following the work items in the
>spec [1], but in a different order.  The basic outline for putting OpenStack on
>Kubernetes will follow a similar path. Where as things like the templates will
>be similar, but the orchestration method can vary. I think that's where the
>biggest controversy lies.


Thanks a lot for all your comments, Ryan. This is useful content and I'll go
through it and ask questions there and/or on IRC.

Flavio

>Thanks!
>-Ryan
>
>[1] - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/304182/
>[2] - https://specs.openstack.org/openstack/fuel-specs/specs/10.0/ccp.html
>[3] - https://review.openstack.org/#/c/335279/
>
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-- 
@flaper87
Flavio Percoco
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