Open Stack

On 25/07/14 06:05, Robert Collins wrote:
> On 25 July 2014 08:01, Sean Dague <sean at dague.net> wrote:
>
>>> I'd like us to think about whether they is anything we can do to make
>>> life easier in these kind of hard debugging scenarios where the regular
>>> logs are not sufficient.
>>
>> Agreed. Honestly, though we do also need to figure out first fail
>> detection on our logs as well. Because realistically if we can't debug
>> failures from those, then I really don't understand how we're ever going
>> to expect large users to.
>
>
> I'm so glad you said that :). In conversations with our users, and
> existing large deployers of Openstack, one thing has come through very
> consistently: our default logs are insufficient.
>
> We had an extensive discussion about this in the TripleO mid-cycle
> meetup, and I think we reached broad consensus on the following:
>   - the defaults should be what folk are running in production
>   - we don't want to lead on changing defaults - its a big enough thing
> we want to drive the discussion but not workaround it by changing our
> defaults
>   - large clouds are *today* running debug (with a few tweaks to remove
> the most egregious log spammers and known security issues [like
> dumping tokens into logs]
>   - AFAICT productised clouds (push-button deploy etc) are running
> something very similar
>   - we would love it if developers *also* saw what users will see by
> default, since that will tend to both stop things getting to spammy,
> and too sparse.
>
> So - I know thats brief - what we'd like to do is to poll a slightly
> wider set of deployers - e.g. via a spec, perhaps some help from Tom
> with the users and ops groups - and get a baseline of things that
> there is consensus on and things that aren't, and then just change the

If a starting point is needed, the last discussion we had around 
'reasonable' defaults is here:

https://etherpad.openstack.org/p/juno-summit-ops-reasonabledefaults


> defaults to match. Further, to achieve the 'developers see the same
> thing as users' bit, we'd like to make devstack do what TripleO does -
> use defaults for logging levels, particularly in the gate.
>
> Its totally true that we have a good policy about logging and we're
> changing things to fit it but thats the long term play: short term,
> making the default meet our deployments seems realtively easy and
> immensely sane.
>
> -Rob
>