[openstack-dev] [all] The future of the integrated release

Clint Byrum clint at fewbar.com
Thu Aug 21 20:12:02 UTC 2014

Excerpts from David Kranz's message of 2014-08-21 12:45:05 -0700:
> On 08/21/2014 02:39 PM, gordon chung wrote:
> > > The point I've been making is
> > > that by the TC continuing to bless only the Ceilometer project as the
> > > OpenStack Way of Metering, I think we do a disservice to our users by
> > > picking a winner in a space that is clearly still unsettled.
> >
> > can we avoid using the word 'blessed' -- it's extremely vague and 
> > seems controversial. from what i know, no one is being told project 
> > x's services are the be all end all and based on experience, companies 
> > (should) know this. i've worked with other alternatives even though i 
> > contribute to ceilometer.
> > > Totally agree with Jay here, I know people who gave up on trying to
> > > get any official project around deployment because they were told they
> > > had to do it under the TripleO umbrella
> > from the pov of a project that seems to be brought up constantly and 
> > maybe it's my naivety, i don't really understand the fascination with 
> > branding and the stigma people have placed on 
> > non-'openstack'/stackforge projects. it can't be a legal thing because 
> > i've gone through that potential mess. also, it's just as easy to 
> > contribute to 'non-openstack' projects as 'openstack' projects (even 
> > easier if we're honest).
> Yes, we should be honest. The "even easier" part is what Sandy cited as 
> the primary motivation for pursuing stacktach instead of ceilometer.
> I think we need to consider the difference between why OpenStack wants 
> to bless a project, and why a project might want to be blessed by 
> OpenStack. Many folks believe that for OpenStack to be successful it 
> needs to present itself as a stack that can be tested and deployed, not 
> a sack of parts that only the most extremely clever people can manage to 
> assemble into an actual cloud. In order to have such a stack, some code 
> (or, alternatively, dare I say API...) needs to be blessed. Reasonable 
> debates will continue about which pieces are essential to this stack, 
> and which should be left to deployers, but metering was seen as such a 
> component and therefore something needed to be blessed. The hope was 
> that every one would jump on that and make it great but it seems that 
> didn't quite happen (at least yet).
> Though Open Source has many advantages over proprietary development, the 
> ability to choose a direction and marshal resources for efficient 
> delivery is the biggest advantage of proprietary development like what 
> AWS does. The TC process of blessing is, IMO, an attempt to compensate 
> for that in an OpenSource project. Of course if the wrong code is 
> blessed, the negative  impact can be significant. Blessing APIs would be 

Hm, I wonder if the only difference there is when AWS blesses the wrong
thing, they evaluate the business impact, and respond by going in a
different direction, all behind closed doors. The shame is limited to
that inner circle.

Here, with full transparency, calling something "the wrong thing" is
pretty much public humiliation for the team involved.

So it stands to reason that we shouldn't call something "the right
thing" if we aren't comfortable with the potential public shaming.

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