撤回: [all] New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
niujie 将撤回邮件“[all] New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal ”。
Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response. I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline. ---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project. By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces). -gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
From: Ghanshyam Mann <gmann@ghanshyammann.com> Date: 2022-04-26 01:51:33 To: niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> Cc: openstack-discuss <openstack-discuss@lists.openstack.org>,sunny <sunny@openstack.org>,'Horace Li' <horace@openstack.org>,"huang.shuquan" <huang.shuquan@99cloud.net>,"gong.yongsheng" <gong.yongsheng@99cloud.net>,"shane.wang" <shane.wang@intel.com>,"jian-feng.ding" <jian-feng.ding@intel.com>,wangshengyjy <wangshengyjy@chinamobile.com>,yuzhiqiang <yuzhiqiang@chinamobile.com>,zhangxiaoguang <zhangxiaoguang@chinamobile.com>,xujianwl <xujianwl@chinamobile.com> Subject: Re: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal>Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response.
I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline.
---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project.
I think It mostly likes an auto scheduling system in a multi-level cloud fabric (multiple data center clouds, multiple edge clouds, multiple far edge clouds) platform. The main process of the system can be described as: first, to collect the resource usage in each cloud node which can be assumed as an openstack deployment. the resource usage can be provided by the openstack placement compomnet, second, to collect lataency, qos or bandwidth of the network resources among the fabric. third, when application deployment needs come in, the fabric should compute the optimal placement strategy and do the deployment. So we will need to create a new project for it.
By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces).
-gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
yongsheng gong 99cloud
Hi All, I wanted to quickly chime in on this thread as well. A few of us from the OpenInfra Foundation had a quick sync with Jie, Zhiqiang and a few others from the China Mobile team to get a better understanding of the CFN initiative and help finding the best way forward. The CFN proposal has a wide scope both in terms of targeted areas and use cases, as well as the solution stack that includes Management & Orchestration and Services & Operations type components as well. OpenStack is one of the key components to CFN and with that the activities would include working with the OpenStack community in areas such as monitoring, scheduling, etc. Based on the discussion with the China Mobile team so far, a SIG within OpenStack doesn’t seem to be the right place to start as it would potentially increase the scope of the OpenStack project or limit the scope of CFN. While based on its scope the CFN initiative has the potential to become a standalone project, we need to explore it further before making any decisions. Thanks and Best Regards, Ildikó ——— Ildikó Váncsa Senior Manager, Community & Ecosystem Open Infrastructure Foundation
On Apr 25, 2022, at 10:51, Ghanshyam Mann <gmann@ghanshyammann.com> wrote:
Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response.
I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline.
---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project.
By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces).
-gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
Hi Ghanshyam, Thanks for forwarding the proposal. Yes, we will figure out exact changes(requirements) based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope by further discussion. As for the application migration, currently we don’t have plan for new project of tooling, we could probably start with tool(based on the discussion), but the ultimate goal is beyond just tooling, the vision of CFN is to achieve ecosystem for development, any application developed on this infrastructure could be migrated to any heterogeneous platforms. This may include build compiling platform on heterogeneous infrastructure, draft standardization for low-level code development, etc. You are right about CFN will not just bring changes to the OpenStack existing components, but also brings potential new source code components, we don't have such list/proposal for new component right now, that's why we would like to raise the CFN topic here, and based on the discussion with global wisdoms, we will figure out the next step. It is a good idea to start with a SIG, we can firstly start discussion here, and maybe re-evaluate as it goes. We have a brief CFN introduction slide, and shall I add a topic in TC weekly meeting agenda? Thanks Jie Niu -----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Tuesday, April 26, 2022 1:52 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: openstack-discuss; sunny; 'Horace Li'; huang.shuquan; gong.yongsheng; shane.wang; jian-feng.ding; wangshengyjy; yuzhiqiang; zhangxiaoguang; xujianwl 主题: Re: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response. I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline. ---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project. By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces). -gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
---- On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 23:21:32 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi Ghanshyam,
Thanks for forwarding the proposal.
Yes, we will figure out exact changes(requirements) based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope by further discussion. As for the application migration, currently we don’t have plan for new project of tooling, we could probably start with tool(based on the discussion), but the ultimate goal is beyond just tooling, the vision of CFN is to achieve ecosystem for development, any application developed on this infrastructure could be migrated to any heterogeneous platforms. This may include build compiling platform on heterogeneous infrastructure, draft standardization for low-level code development, etc.
You are right about CFN will not just bring changes to the OpenStack existing components, but also brings potential new source code components, we don't have such list/proposal for new component right now, that's why we would like to raise the CFN topic here, and based on the discussion with global wisdoms, we will figure out the next step.
It is a good idea to start with a SIG, we can firstly start discussion here, and maybe re-evaluate as it goes.
We have a brief CFN introduction slide, and shall I add a topic in TC weekly meeting agenda?
I am fine to discuss it in TC meeting but I saw updates (ML reply too) from Ildiko that there is some discussion going on between foundation and your team and it seems CFN scope is more than OpenStack SIG and SIG is not right place to start with and you think SIG can be good place to start (I also have no objection on that). I think to have everyone on the same page, we need to discuss it together, I am ok to have that in TC weekly meeting including your team, foundation, and TC or a separate call. Whatever works for you and Ildiko (other foundation staff), please let me know. At the end, it does not matter much where we start it as SIG or separate infra project. Irrespective of the place, whatever you need from OpenStack community we will be supporting/implementing that as per use case and scope. [1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2022-April/028311.htm... -gmann
Thanks Jie Niu
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Tuesday, April 26, 2022 1:52 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: openstack-discuss; sunny; 'Horace Li'; huang.shuquan; gong.yongsheng; shane.wang; jian-feng.ding; wangshengyjy; yuzhiqiang; zhangxiaoguang; xujianwl 主题: Re: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response.
I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline.
---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project.
By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces).
-gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
Thanks Ghanshyam, Actually I saw Ildiko's email after my email was sent out :) My email was being held several hours for moderator before arrived because too many recipients, sorry for my expression about SIG and the confusion it might cause. For the new group proposal, we were not every clear of what kind of group is appropriate, SIG is the only option we know :), right now, we don't want to disobey any of the community's guidance, seems it's better we do not continue SIG or working-group proposal discussion until we got recommendation from the community. So we probably wait guidance before making next step(or group discussion), is it OK? As for the CFN topic, if anyone is interested and want to know more about what is CFN, we have a introduction slide, it is the same one we shared to the foundation. If you think it's good to share it on TC weekly meeting or any other form of share session, please tell us and we can share it. Thank you! Jie -----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Wednesday, April 27, 2022 7:32 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: 'openstack-discuss'; 'sunny'; 'Horace Li'; 'huang.shuquan'; 'gong.yongsheng'; 'shane.wang'; 'jian-feng.ding'; 'wangshengyjy'; 'yuzhiqiang'; 'zhangxiaoguang'; xujianwl 主题: RE: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal ---- On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 23:21:32 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi Ghanshyam,
Thanks for forwarding the proposal.
Yes, we will figure out exact changes(requirements) based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope by further discussion. As for the application migration, currently we don’t have plan for new project of tooling, we could probably start with tool(based on the discussion), but the ultimate goal is beyond just tooling, the vision of CFN is to achieve ecosystem for development, any application developed on this infrastructure could be migrated to any heterogeneous platforms. This may include build compiling platform on heterogeneous infrastructure, draft standardization for low-level code development, etc.
You are right about CFN will not just bring changes to the OpenStack existing components, but also brings potential new source code components, we don't have such list/proposal for new component right now, that's why we would like to raise the CFN topic here, and based on the discussion with global wisdoms, we will figure out the next step.
It is a good idea to start with a SIG, we can firstly start discussion here, and maybe re-evaluate as it goes.
We have a brief CFN introduction slide, and shall I add a topic in TC weekly meeting agenda?
I am fine to discuss it in TC meeting but I saw updates (ML reply too) from Ildiko that there is some discussion going on between foundation and your team and it seems CFN scope is more than OpenStack SIG and SIG is not right place to start with and you think SIG can be good place to start (I also have no objection on that). I think to have everyone on the same page, we need to discuss it together, I am ok to have that in TC weekly meeting including your team, foundation, and TC or a separate call. Whatever works for you and Ildiko (other foundation staff), please let me know. At the end, it does not matter much where we start it as SIG or separate infra project. Irrespective of the place, whatever you need from OpenStack community we will be supporting/implementing that as per use case and scope. [1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2022-April/028311.htm... -gmann
Thanks Jie Niu
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Tuesday, April 26, 2022 1:52 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: openstack-discuss; sunny; 'Horace Li'; huang.shuquan; gong.yongsheng; shane.wang; jian-feng.ding; wangshengyjy; yuzhiqiang; zhangxiaoguang; xujianwl 主题: Re: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response.
I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline.
---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project.
By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces).
-gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
On 2022-04-27 11:22:05 +0800 (+0800), niujie wrote: [...]
My email was being held several hours for moderator before arrived because too many recipients [...]
As an aside, it's not recommended to Cc additional recipients when posting to a mailing list, since that has a tendency to result in split discussions among non-subscribers and duplicate deliveries for list subscribers. Encourage non-subscribers to participate in the discussion either by subscribing to the list or following along with the Web archive at http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/ depending on which they find most convenient. -- Jeremy Stanley
---- On Wed, 27 Apr 2022 08:23:57 -0500 Jeremy Stanley <fungi@yuggoth.org> wrote ----
On 2022-04-27 11:22:05 +0800 (+0800), niujie wrote: [...]
My email was being held several hours for moderator before arrived because too many recipients [...]
As an aside, it's not recommended to Cc additional recipients when posting to a mailing list, since that has a tendency to result in split discussions among non-subscribers and duplicate deliveries for list subscribers. Encourage non-subscribers to participate in the discussion either by subscribing to the list or following along with the Web archive at http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/ depending on which they find most convenient.
Well, that is what I raised concern in tc channel when my reply went to approval first. It could make these kind of async while replying and seeing other reply depends on when your email is approved by moderator. We cannot expcet moderator will keep eyes on every min for this ML thread. I still stand on my proposal to relax this 'more recipients ' rule at least making recipients number threshold to 20 or so. That will definitely benefit the new thread from new people. The Current rule is causing more issues then its benefits, at least with current limit of recipients numbers. -gmann
-- Jeremy Stanley
On 2022-04-27 11:51:05 -0500 (-0500), Ghanshyam Mann wrote: [...]
Well, that is what I raised concern in tc channel when my reply went to approval first. It could make these kind of async while replying and seeing other reply depends on when your email is approved by moderator. We cannot expcet moderator will keep eyes on every min for this ML thread.
I still stand on my proposal to relax this 'more recipients ' rule at least making recipients number threshold to 20 or so. That will definitely benefit the new thread from new people.
The Current rule is causing more issues then its benefits, at least with current limit of recipients numbers.
I already approve numerous messages out of the moderation queue for this list every day for other reasons (and discard orders of magnitude more caught spam), so the recipients limit check is not increasing my workload as a list moderator. If people generally feel that having extra recipients besides the list address is acceptable, then I would just remove the check rather than raising it (10 recipients is already a lot). What *will* increase my workload is manually replying to people every time I see a massive recipient count in a list message in order to refer them to the https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/MailingListEtiquette#Keep_Discussions_On-Lis... section of our netiquette guidelines. Right now the automated check provides a signal without any additional work on my part. -- Jeremy Stanley
---- On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 22:22:05 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Thanks Ghanshyam,
Actually I saw Ildiko's email after my email was sent out :) My email was being held several hours for moderator before arrived because too many recipients, sorry for my expression about SIG and the confusion it might cause.
For the new group proposal, we were not every clear of what kind of group is appropriate, SIG is the only option we know :), right now, we don't want to disobey any of the community's guidance, seems it's better we do not continue SIG or working-group proposal discussion until we got recommendation from the community. So we probably wait guidance before making next step(or group discussion), is it OK?
No problem Jie, and thanks for the detail plan. As you are in discussion with foundation on possible place for CFN, I will say you can continue that and if you or foundation need/think we need some place in OpenStack community to add it or some component of it then we can discuss it in TC. Feel free to add it in TC weekly meeting agenda anytime or send me an email and i can add that- - https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee#Next_Meeting -gmann
As for the CFN topic, if anyone is interested and want to know more about what is CFN, we have a introduction slide, it is the same one we shared to the foundation. If you think it's good to share it on TC weekly meeting or any other form of share session, please tell us and we can share it.
Thank you! Jie
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Wednesday, April 27, 2022 7:32 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: 'openstack-discuss'; 'sunny'; 'Horace Li'; 'huang.shuquan'; 'gong.yongsheng'; 'shane.wang'; 'jian-feng.ding'; 'wangshengyjy'; 'yuzhiqiang'; 'zhangxiaoguang'; xujianwl 主题: RE: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
---- On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 23:21:32 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi Ghanshyam,
Thanks for forwarding the proposal.
Yes, we will figure out exact changes(requirements) based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope by further discussion. As for the application migration, currently we don’t have plan for new project of tooling, we could probably start with tool(based on the discussion), but the ultimate goal is beyond just tooling, the vision of CFN is to achieve ecosystem for development, any application developed on this infrastructure could be migrated to any heterogeneous platforms. This may include build compiling platform on heterogeneous infrastructure, draft standardization for low-level code development, etc.
You are right about CFN will not just bring changes to the OpenStack existing components, but also brings potential new source code components, we don't have such list/proposal for new component right now, that's why we would like to raise the CFN topic here, and based on the discussion with global wisdoms, we will figure out the next step.
It is a good idea to start with a SIG, we can firstly start discussion here, and maybe re-evaluate as it goes.
We have a brief CFN introduction slide, and shall I add a topic in TC weekly meeting agenda?
I am fine to discuss it in TC meeting but I saw updates (ML reply too) from Ildiko that there is some discussion going on between foundation and your team and it seems CFN scope is more than OpenStack SIG and SIG is not right place to start with and you think SIG can be good place to start (I also have no objection on that).
I think to have everyone on the same page, we need to discuss it together, I am ok to have that in TC weekly meeting including your team, foundation, and TC or a separate call. Whatever works for you and Ildiko (other foundation staff), please let me know.
At the end, it does not matter much where we start it as SIG or separate infra project. Irrespective of the place, whatever you need from OpenStack community we will be supporting/implementing that as per use case and scope.
[1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2022-April/028311.htm...
-gmann
Thanks Jie Niu
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Tuesday, April 26, 2022 1:52 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: openstack-discuss; sunny; 'Horace Li'; huang.shuquan; gong.yongsheng; shane.wang; jian-feng.ding; wangshengyjy; yuzhiqiang; zhangxiaoguang; xujianwl 主题: Re: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response.
I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline.
---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project.
By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces).
-gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
We would like to make a brief introduction about CFN to the community, we will not discuss any kind of working group application, just purely sharing CFN concept, vision and related technologies, and hopefully we can get more people interested in this topic . Do you think TC meeting is a good place to start with? If so, we are ok with next week's TC meeting, and I can add agenda. Thanks Jie Niu -----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Thursday, April 28, 2022 12:56 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: 'openstack-discuss'; 'sunny'; 'Horace Li'; 'huang.shuquan'; 'gong.yongsheng'; 'shane.wang'; 'jian-feng.ding'; 'wangshengyjy'; 'yuzhiqiang'; 'zhangxiaoguang'; 'xujianwl' 主题: RE: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal ---- On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 22:22:05 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Thanks Ghanshyam,
Actually I saw Ildiko's email after my email was sent out :) My email was being held several hours for moderator before arrived because too many recipients, sorry for my expression about SIG and the confusion it might cause.
For the new group proposal, we were not every clear of what kind of group is appropriate, SIG is the only option we know :), right now, we don't want to disobey any of the community's guidance, seems it's better we do not continue SIG or working-group proposal discussion until we got recommendation from the community. So we probably wait guidance before making next step(or group discussion), is it OK?
No problem Jie, and thanks for the detail plan. As you are in discussion with foundation on possible place for CFN, I will say you can continue that and if you or foundation need/think we need some place in OpenStack community to add it or some component of it then we can discuss it in TC. Feel free to add it in TC weekly meeting agenda anytime or send me an email and i can add that- - https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee#Next_Meeting -gmann
As for the CFN topic, if anyone is interested and want to know more about what is CFN, we have a introduction slide, it is the same one we shared to the foundation. If you think it's good to share it on TC weekly meeting or any other form of share session, please tell us and we can share it.
Thank you! Jie
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Wednesday, April 27, 2022 7:32 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: 'openstack-discuss'; 'sunny'; 'Horace Li'; 'huang.shuquan'; 'gong.yongsheng'; 'shane.wang'; 'jian-feng.ding'; 'wangshengyjy'; 'yuzhiqiang'; 'zhangxiaoguang'; xujianwl 主题: RE: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
---- On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 23:21:32 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi Ghanshyam,
Thanks for forwarding the proposal.
Yes, we will figure out exact changes(requirements) based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope by further discussion. As for the application migration, currently we don’t have plan for new project of tooling, we could probably start with tool(based on the discussion), but the ultimate goal is beyond just tooling, the vision of CFN is to achieve ecosystem for development, any application developed on this infrastructure could be migrated to any heterogeneous platforms. This may include build compiling platform on heterogeneous infrastructure, draft standardization for low-level code development, etc.
You are right about CFN will not just bring changes to the OpenStack existing components, but also brings potential new source code components, we don't have such list/proposal for new component right now, that's why we would like to raise the CFN topic here, and based on the discussion with global wisdoms, we will figure out the next step.
It is a good idea to start with a SIG, we can firstly start discussion here, and maybe re-evaluate as it goes.
We have a brief CFN introduction slide, and shall I add a topic in TC weekly meeting agenda?
I am fine to discuss it in TC meeting but I saw updates (ML reply too) from Ildiko that there is some discussion going on between foundation and your team and it seems CFN scope is more than OpenStack SIG and SIG is not right place to start with and you think SIG can be good place to start (I also have no objection on that).
I think to have everyone on the same page, we need to discuss it together, I am ok to have that in TC weekly meeting including your team, foundation, and TC or a separate call. Whatever works for you and Ildiko (other foundation staff), please let me know.
At the end, it does not matter much where we start it as SIG or separate infra project. Irrespective of the place, whatever you need from OpenStack community we will be supporting/implementing that as per use case and scope.
[1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2022-April/028311.htm...
-gmann
Thanks Jie Niu
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Tuesday, April 26, 2022 1:52 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: openstack-discuss; sunny; 'Horace Li'; huang.shuquan; gong.yongsheng; shane.wang; jian-feng.ding; wangshengyjy; yuzhiqiang; zhangxiaoguang; xujianwl 主题: Re: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response.
I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline.
---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project.
By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces).
-gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
---- On Thu, 28 Apr 2022 05:15:02 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
We would like to make a brief introduction about CFN to the community, we will not discuss any kind of working group application, just purely sharing CFN concept, vision and related technologies, and hopefully we can get more people interested in this topic . Do you think TC meeting is a good place to start with? If so, we are ok with next week's TC meeting, and I can add agenda.
Sure, why not. Our next TC meeting is on 5th May and its video call so good timing. Please let me know how much time you need. Along with presenting to TC, I will suggest it will be a great to present it to wider audiance also like in OpenInfra Summit. As next Summit schedule is already out. please check with foundation if there is any space you can fit it. But I like the idea to give overview in TC meeting and see if more people get interest and ready to collaborate. -gmann
Thanks Jie Niu
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Thursday, April 28, 2022 12:56 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: 'openstack-discuss'; 'sunny'; 'Horace Li'; 'huang.shuquan'; 'gong.yongsheng'; 'shane.wang'; 'jian-feng.ding'; 'wangshengyjy'; 'yuzhiqiang'; 'zhangxiaoguang'; 'xujianwl' 主题: RE: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
---- On Tue, 26 Apr 2022 22:22:05 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Thanks Ghanshyam,
Actually I saw Ildiko's email after my email was sent out :) My email was being held several hours for moderator before arrived because too many recipients, sorry for my expression about SIG and the confusion it might cause.
For the new group proposal, we were not every clear of what kind of group is appropriate, SIG is the only option we know :), right now, we don't want to disobey any of the community's guidance, seems it's better we do not continue SIG or working-group proposal discussion until we got recommendation from the community. So we probably wait guidance before making next step(or group discussion), is it OK?
No problem Jie, and thanks for the detail plan. As you are in discussion with foundation on possible place for CFN, I will say you can continue that and if you or foundation need/think we need some place in OpenStack community to add it or some component of it then we can discuss it in TC.
Feel free to add it in TC weekly meeting agenda anytime or send me an email and i can add that- - https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/TechnicalCommittee#Next_Meeting
-gmann
As for the CFN topic, if anyone is interested and want to know more about what is CFN, we have a introduction slide, it is the same one we shared to the foundation. If you think it's good to share it on TC weekly meeting or any other form of share session, please tell us and we can share it.
Thank you! Jie
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Wednesday, April 27, 2022 7:32 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: 'openstack-discuss'; 'sunny'; 'Horace Li'; 'huang.shuquan'; 'gong.yongsheng'; 'shane.wang'; 'jian-feng.ding'; 'wangshengyjy'; 'yuzhiqiang'; 'zhangxiaoguang'; xujianwl 主题: RE: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
---- On Mon, 25 Apr 2022 23:21:32 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi Ghanshyam,
Thanks for forwarding the proposal.
Yes, we will figure out exact changes(requirements) based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope by further discussion. As for the application migration, currently we don’t have plan for new project of tooling, we could probably start with tool(based on the discussion), but the ultimate goal is beyond just tooling, the vision of CFN is to achieve ecosystem for development, any application developed on this infrastructure could be migrated to any heterogeneous platforms. This may include build compiling platform on heterogeneous infrastructure, draft standardization for low-level code development, etc.
You are right about CFN will not just bring changes to the OpenStack existing components, but also brings potential new source code components, we don't have such list/proposal for new component right now, that's why we would like to raise the CFN topic here, and based on the discussion with global wisdoms, we will figure out the next step.
It is a good idea to start with a SIG, we can firstly start discussion here, and maybe re-evaluate as it goes.
We have a brief CFN introduction slide, and shall I add a topic in TC weekly meeting agenda?
I am fine to discuss it in TC meeting but I saw updates (ML reply too) from Ildiko that there is some discussion going on between foundation and your team and it seems CFN scope is more than OpenStack SIG and SIG is not right place to start with and you think SIG can be good place to start (I also have no objection on that).
I think to have everyone on the same page, we need to discuss it together, I am ok to have that in TC weekly meeting including your team, foundation, and TC or a separate call. Whatever works for you and Ildiko (other foundation staff), please let me know.
At the end, it does not matter much where we start it as SIG or separate infra project. Irrespective of the place, whatever you need from OpenStack community we will be supporting/implementing that as per use case and scope.
[1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2022-April/028311.htm...
-gmann
Thanks Jie Niu
-----邮件原件----- 发件人: Ghanshyam Mann [mailto:gmann@ghanshyammann.com] 发送时间: Tuesday, April 26, 2022 1:52 AM 收件人: niujie 抄送: openstack-discuss; sunny; 'Horace Li'; huang.shuquan; gong.yongsheng; shane.wang; jian-feng.ding; wangshengyjy; yuzhiqiang; zhangxiaoguang; xujianwl 主题: Re: [all] Resend New CFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal
Thanks, Niu for the proposal and sorry for the delay in response.
I have raised this proposal to TC members and asking to check it. Overall proposal seems interesting to me but few initial queries inline.
---- On Wed, 13 Apr 2022 00:34:30 -0500 niujie <niujie@chinamobile.com> wrote ----
Hi all I sent an email yesterday about NewCFN(Computing Force Network) SIG Proposal, I tried to recall it because therewas a typo in email address, then I get recall failed msg, so I assume the emailwas sent out successfully, and plan to keep it as it was. But I found that the “recall” actionwas logged in pipermail, it might cause misunderstanding, we are sure about proposefor a new SIG, so I’m sending this again, sorry for the email flood J
I'm from China Mobile, China Mobile is recently working onbuild a new information infrastructure focusing on connectivity, computingpower, and capabilities, this new information infrastructure is calledComputing Force Network, we think OpenStack community which gathers globalwisdom together is a perfect platform to discuss topics like CFN, so we areproposing to create a new SIG for CFN(Computing Force Network). Below is CFNbrief introduction and initial SIG scope. With the flourish of new business scenarios such as hybridcloud, multi-cloud, AI, big data processing, edge computing, building a newinformation infrastructure based on multiple key technologies that convergedcloud and network, will better support global digital transformation. This newinfrastructure is not only relates to cloud, it is getting more and moreconnected with network, and at the same time, we also need to consider how toconverge multiple technologies like AI, Blockchain, big data, security to providethis all-in-one service. Computing Force Network(CFN) is a new informationinfrastructure that based on network, focused on computing, deeply convergedArtificial intelligence, Block chain, Cloud, Data, Network, Edge computing, Endapplication, Security(ABCDNETS), providing all-in-one services. Xiaodong Duan, Vice president of China Mobile ResearchInstitute, introduced the vision and architecture of Computing Force Network in2021 November OpenInfra Live Keynotes by his presentation Connection +Computing + Capability Opens a New Era of Digital Infrastructure, heproposed the new era of CFN. We are expecting to work with OpenStack on how to buildthis new information infrastructure, and how to promote the development andimplementation of next generation infrastructure, achieve ubiquitous computingforce, computing & network convergence, intelligence orchestration,all-in-one service. Then computing force will become common utilities likewater and electric step by step, computing force will be ready for access uponuse and connected by single entry point. The above vision of CFN , from technical perspective, willmainly focus on unified management and orchestration of computing + networkintegrated system, computing and network deeply converged in architecture, formand protocols aspect, bringing potential changes to OpenStack components. CFNis aiming to achieve seamlessly migration of any application between anyheterogeneous platforms, it's a challenge for the industry currently, we feelthat in pursuit of CFN could potentially contributes to the development andevolution of OpenStack.
Yes, it will require changes to OpenStack components but we will see based on the exact use case and OpenStack component scope. Is this include the application migration tooling in OpenStack?
In this CFN SIG, we will mainly focus on discussing how tobuild the new information infrastructure of CFN, related key technologies, andwhat's the impact on OpenStack brought by the network & could convergencetrend , the topics are including but not limited to: 1, Acomputing basement for unified management of container, VM and Bare Metal 2,Computing infrastructure which eliminated the difference between heterogeneoushardware 3,Measurement criteria and scheduling scheme based on unified computinginfrastructure 4,Network solutions for SDN integrating smart NIC for data center 5,Unified orchestration & management for "network + cloud", and"cloud + edge + end" integrated scheduling solution We will have regular meetings to investigate and discussbusiness scenarios, development trend, technical scheme, release technicaldocuments, technical proposal and requirements for OpenStack Projects, andpropose new project when necessary. We will also collaborate with other open source projectslike LFN, CNCF, LFE, to have a consistent plan across communities, and alignwith global standardization organization like ETSI, 3GPP, IETF, to promote CFNrelated technical scheme become the standard in industry. If you have any thoughts, interests, questions,requirements, we can discuss by this mailing list.
Thanks for the detailed information about the SIG scope. From the above, I understood that it will not be just changed to the OpenStack existing component but also new source code components also, do you have such list/proposal for a new component or you would like to continue discussing it and based on that you will get to know. How you are thinking about their (new component if any) releases like a coordinated release with OpenStack or independent. If coordinated then it is more than SIG scope and might be good to add a new project.
By seeing the scope of this proposal (which seems very wider), I think it is not required to answer all of them now. Overall I am ok to start it as SIG and based on discussion/progress evaluation we will get to know more about new components, requirements etc and then we can change it from SIG to a new project under OpenStack or other governance (based on the core/requirement/use case it produces).
-gmann
Any suggestions are welcomed, and we are really hoping tohear from anyone, and work with you.
Jie Niu China Mobile
participants (5)
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Ghanshyam Mann
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Ildiko Vancsa
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Jeremy Stanley
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niujie
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龚永生