[All][StoryBoard] Angular.js Alternatives
Hello Everyone! The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities: Vue.js or React.js I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful! Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3]. Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread! -Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team [1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
On 2021-01-21 13:23:25 -0800 (-0800), Kendall Nelson wrote:
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. [...]
See also the minutes and log from the weekly meeting where initial discussion of these points took place: http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2021/storyboard.2021-01-2... -- Jeremy Stanley
On Jan 21, 2021, at 15:23, Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
Zuul’s dashboard is React, which I see you’ve already got in there. We actually wrote the initial version of it in Angular but then migrated to React. +1 on React In a vacuum I’ve heard good things about Vue - and it’s lighter-weight. But the general adjacency of Zuul and Storyboard in OpenDev would make me suggest benefits of going React.
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 10:24 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
Hello, Kendall! This is likely the toughest question in the frontend universe at the moment. Both solutions are very well thought out and have solid ecosystems. Based on observed productivity both are good choices. Personally, I have done more Vue than React. I have added a few points in the etherpad. Angular is not a bad choice either but it involves much stronger bonding with the final product. The others leave more freedom of choice. As for the verdict, I am afraid the best solution would be to run voting for parties interested in Storyboard development and just stick to the poll winner. -yoctozepto
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
For better or for worse, we are a pretty small team and don't need to poll since we can all attend a meeting and agree there. Calling for outside opinions was also a half hearted plea for help :) -Kendall (diablo_rojo) On Fri, Jan 22, 2021 at 1:28 AM Radosław Piliszek < radoslaw.piliszek@gmail.com> wrote:
On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 10:24 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its
going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
Hello, Kendall!
This is likely the toughest question in the frontend universe at the moment. Both solutions are very well thought out and have solid ecosystems. Based on observed productivity both are good choices. Personally, I have done more Vue than React. I have added a few points in the etherpad. Angular is not a bad choice either but it involves much stronger bonding with the final product. The others leave more freedom of choice.
As for the verdict, I am afraid the best solution would be to run voting for parties interested in Storyboard development and just stick to the poll winner.
-yoctozepto
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
On Tue, 2021-01-26 at 12:51 -0800, Kendall Nelson wrote:
For better or for worse, we are a pretty small team and don't need to poll since we can all attend a meeting and agree there.
Calling for outside opinions was also a half hearted plea for help :)
Is this an indication that we finally have to settle on another bug tracker? This has been discussed previously but I can't find any conclusions from those past discussions, hence I'm asking again. I do not intend to dismiss the hard work of those people working on StoryBoard in the slightest, but it does seem like StoryBoard as a project has never really taken off outside OpenStack and is having a hard time surviving, let alone growing, likely because of that along with the widespread use of forge-style tools (GitHub, GitLab) and more comprehensive project management tools (sigh, JIRA). I recall fungi (?) raising the idea of enabling the more forge'y features, including the issue tracker, of Gitea in the past, but there are also separate tools like (heaven forbid) Bugzilla, Trac, Mantis, etc. that we could use. Heck, Launchpad is still around and is still open source (though I recall there being other issues with that?). We've already made a tough decision recently, with the sunsetting of ask.o.o, and with the impending deprecation of Angular.js, perhaps this is as good a time as any to do the same with StoryBoard? /me goes back to logging in for the zillionth time while trying to triage OSC bugs :) Cheers, Stephen
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Fri, Jan 22, 2021 at 1:28 AM Radosław Piliszek <radoslaw.piliszek@gmail.com> wrote:
On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 10:24 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its
going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
Hello, Kendall!
This is likely the toughest question in the frontend universe at the moment. Both solutions are very well thought out and have solid ecosystems. Based on observed productivity both are good choices. Personally, I have done more Vue than React. I have added a few points in the etherpad. Angular is not a bad choice either but it involves much stronger bonding with the final product. The others leave more freedom of choice.
As for the verdict, I am afraid the best solution would be to run voting for parties interested in Storyboard development and just stick to the poll winner.
-yoctozepto
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 11:18 AM Stephen Finucane <stephenfin@redhat.com> wrote:
On Tue, 2021-01-26 at 12:51 -0800, Kendall Nelson wrote:
For better or for worse, we are a pretty small team and don't need to poll since we can all attend a meeting and agree there.
Calling for outside opinions was also a half hearted plea for help :)
Is this an indication that we finally have to settle on another bug tracker? This has been discussed previously but I can't find any conclusions from those past discussions, hence I'm asking again. I do not intend to dismiss the hard work of those people working on StoryBoard in the slightest, but it does seem like StoryBoard as a project has never really taken off outside OpenStack and is having a hard time surviving, let alone growing, likely because of that along with the widespread use of forge-style tools (GitHub, GitLab) and more comprehensive project management tools (sigh, JIRA). I recall fungi (?) raising the idea of enabling the more forge'y features, including the issue tracker, of Gitea in the past, but there are also separate tools like (heaven forbid) Bugzilla, Trac, Mantis, etc. that we could use. Heck, Launchpad is still around and is still open source (though I recall there being other issues with that?). We've already made a tough decision recently, with the sunsetting of ask.o.o, and with the impending deprecation of Angular.js, perhaps this is as good a time as any to do the same with StoryBoard?
FWIW, I started a similar thread in September 2020: [1] You might want to read it too. [1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-September/017164... -yoctozepto
On Wed, 2021-01-27 at 14:52 +0100, Radosław Piliszek wrote:
On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 11:18 AM Stephen Finucane <stephenfin@redhat.com> wrote:
On Tue, 2021-01-26 at 12:51 -0800, Kendall Nelson wrote:
For better or for worse, we are a pretty small team and don't need to poll since we can all attend a meeting and agree there.
Calling for outside opinions was also a half hearted plea for help :)
Is this an indication that we finally have to settle on another bug tracker? This has been discussed previously but I can't find any conclusions from those past discussions, hence I'm asking again. I do not intend to dismiss the hard work of those people working on StoryBoard in the slightest, but it does seem like StoryBoard as a project has never really taken off outside OpenStack and is having a hard time surviving, let alone growing, likely because of that along with the widespread use of forge-style tools (GitHub, GitLab) and more comprehensive project management tools (sigh, JIRA). I recall fungi (?) raising the idea of enabling the more forge'y features, including the issue tracker, of Gitea in the past, but there are also separate tools like (heaven forbid) Bugzilla, Trac, Mantis, etc. that we could use. Heck, Launchpad is still around and is still open source (though I recall there being other issues with that?). We've already made a tough decision recently, with the sunsetting of ask.o.o, and with the impending deprecation of Angular.js, perhaps this is as good a time as any to do the same with StoryBoard?
FWIW, I started a similar thread in September 2020: [1] You might want to read it too.
[1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-September/017164...
Ugh, my search wasn't anywhere near thorough enough. Apologies and thanks for the link. To summarize, it seems the blocker to using Gitea's issue tracking feature is (a) lack of support for confidential issues and (b) how the front-end is currently deployed, while the reason not to prefer Launchpad is the requirement to use Canonical's SSO. We're not going to be able to fix the latter so someone needs to either add confidential issue support to Gitea or propose yet another tool to fill the gap. That or help rewrite the entire frontend of StoryBoard, of course :) /me also wonders how rough newer versions of upstream Bugzilla (vs. the heavily customized Mozilla and Red Hat instances) are these days. Cheers, Stephen
-yoctozepto
On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 5:12 PM Stephen Finucane <stephenfin@redhat.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 11:18 AM Stephen Finucane <stephenfin@redhat.com> wrote:
On Tue, 2021-01-26 at 12:51 -0800, Kendall Nelson wrote:
For better or for worse, we are a pretty small team and don't need
to poll
since we can all attend a meeting and agree there.
Calling for outside opinions was also a half hearted plea for help :)
Is this an indication that we finally have to settle on another bug
This has been discussed previously but I can't find any conclusions from those past discussions, hence I'm asking again. I do not intend to dismiss
work of those people working on StoryBoard in the slightest, but it does seem like StoryBoard as a project has never really taken off outside OpenStack and is having a hard time surviving, let alone growing, likely because of
with the widespread use of forge-style tools (GitHub, GitLab) and more comprehensive project management tools (sigh, JIRA). I recall fungi (?) raising the idea of enabling the more forge'y features, including the issue
On Wed, 2021-01-27 at 14:52 +0100, Radosław Piliszek wrote: tracker? the hard that along tracker, of
Gitea in the past, but there are also separate tools like (heaven forbid) Bugzilla, Trac, Mantis, etc. that we could use. Heck, Launchpad is still around and is still open source (though I recall there being other issues with that?). We've already made a tough decision recently, with the sunsetting of ask.o.o, and with the impending deprecation of Angular.js, perhaps this is as good a time as any to do the same with StoryBoard?
FWIW, I started a similar thread in September 2020: [1] You might want to read it too.
[1] http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-September/017164...
Ugh, my search wasn't anywhere near thorough enough. Apologies and thanks for the link. To summarize, it seems the blocker to using Gitea's issue tracking feature is (a) lack of support for confidential issues and (b) how the front-end is currently deployed, while the reason not to prefer Launchpad is the requirement to use Canonical's SSO. We're not going to be able to fix the latter so someone needs to either add confidential issue support to Gitea or propose yet another tool to fill the gap. That or help rewrite the entire frontend of StoryBoard, of course :)
/me also wonders how rough newer versions of upstream Bugzilla (vs. the heavily customized Mozilla and Red Hat instances) are these days.
I only have experience with the Red Hat instance, and I find virtually any other solution superior to it, including a shared folder over NFS (only half-kidding). Dmitry
Cheers, Stephen
-yoctozepto
-- Red Hat GmbH, https://de.redhat.com/ , Registered seat: Grasbrunn, Commercial register: Amtsgericht Muenchen, HRB 153243, Managing Directors: Charles Cachera, Brian Klemm, Laurie Krebs, Michael O'Neill
Hi, Since React.js was listed as a option, I'd also consider Preact[1] which is a smaller / faster react-compatible implementation with browser-native virtual DOM implementation using "htm"[2] which can even eliminate build tooling. Not affiliated, just keeping an eye on it. Cheers, Mark [1]: https://preactjs.com/ [2]: https://github.com/developit/htm On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 01:23:25PM -0800, Kendall Nelson wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
-- This email is signed with the PGP key: 8EA1 89A1 41E6 D1F0 Verify and send me an encrypted email: https://keybase.io/encrypt#kmarc
To circle back to this, the StoryBoard team has decided on Vue, given some contributors previous experience with it and a POC already started. Thank you everyone for your valuable input! We really do appreciate it! -Kendall (diablo_rojo) On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 1:23 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
Sorry for being late to the thread, but it might be worth touching base with Horizon peeps as well, because there could potentially be some useful knowledge/contributor sharing if we all stick to similar libraries for front end when the eventually Horizon rewrite starts. I'm sadly also out of the loop there so no clue if they even know what direction they plan to go in. Although given the good things I've heard about Vue.js I can't say it's a bad choice (but neither would have been react). On 29/01/21 7:33 am, Kendall Nelson wrote:
To circle back to this, the StoryBoard team has decided on Vue, given some contributors previous experience with it and a POC already started.
Thank you everyone for your valuable input! We really do appreciate it!
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 1:23 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com <mailto:kennelson11@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ <https://vuejs.org/> [2] https://reactjs.org/ <https://reactjs.org/> [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research <https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research>
Horizon has a similar issue with the Angular.js components. Since there is documentation[1] for migrating from Angular.js (the version reaching end-of-life) to Angular(2/4) I had assumed we would be migrating Horizon and the plugins to Angular. It would be nice to align all of the OpenInfra components to the same framework. I agree with Adrian, I would like to include feedback from the Horizon folks. Michael [1] https://angular.io/guide/upgrade On Mon, Feb 1, 2021 at 11:07 PM Adrian Turjak <adriant@catalystcloud.nz> wrote:
Sorry for being late to the thread, but it might be worth touching base with Horizon peeps as well, because there could potentially be some useful knowledge/contributor sharing if we all stick to similar libraries for front end when the eventually Horizon rewrite starts. I'm sadly also out of the loop there so no clue if they even know what direction they plan to go in.
Although given the good things I've heard about Vue.js I can't say it's a bad choice (but neither would have been react).
On 29/01/21 7:33 am, Kendall Nelson wrote:
To circle back to this, the StoryBoard team has decided on Vue, given some contributors previous experience with it and a POC already started.
Thank you everyone for your valuable input! We really do appreciate it!
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 1:23 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
From most of my front end dev friends I've heard that a migration away from AngularJS is basically a rewrite, so switching to Vue.js or React.js now if we think that's the best idea isn't a stretch at all. I just think that if we stick to one frontend framework for most of OpenStack it can make it easier to share resources. :) On 4/02/21 12:05 pm, Michael Johnson wrote:
Horizon has a similar issue with the Angular.js components.
Since there is documentation[1] for migrating from Angular.js (the version reaching end-of-life) to Angular(2/4) I had assumed we would be migrating Horizon and the plugins to Angular.
It would be nice to align all of the OpenInfra components to the same framework. I agree with Adrian, I would like to include feedback from the Horizon folks.
Michael
[1] https://angular.io/guide/upgrade
On Mon, Feb 1, 2021 at 11:07 PM Adrian Turjak <adriant@catalystcloud.nz> wrote:
Sorry for being late to the thread, but it might be worth touching base with Horizon peeps as well, because there could potentially be some useful knowledge/contributor sharing if we all stick to similar libraries for front end when the eventually Horizon rewrite starts. I'm sadly also out of the loop there so no clue if they even know what direction they plan to go in.
Although given the good things I've heard about Vue.js I can't say it's a bad choice (but neither would have been react).
On 29/01/21 7:33 am, Kendall Nelson wrote:
To circle back to this, the StoryBoard team has decided on Vue, given some contributors previous experience with it and a POC already started.
Thank you everyone for your valuable input! We really do appreciate it!
-Kendall (diablo_rojo)
On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 1:23 PM Kendall Nelson <kennelson11@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello Everyone!
The StoryBoard team is looking at alternatives to Angular.js since its going end of life. After some research, we've boiled all the options down to two possibilities:
Vue.js
or
React.js
I am diving more deeply into researching those two options this week, but any opinions or feedback on your experiences with either of them would be helpful!
Here is the etherpad with our research so far[3].
Feel free to add opinions there or in response to this thread!
-Kendall Nelson (diablo_rojo) & The StoryBoard Team
[1] https://vuejs.org/ [2] https://reactjs.org/ [3] https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/replace-angularjs-storyboard-research
Adrian Turjak wrote:
[...] I just think that if we stick to one frontend framework for most of OpenStack it can make it easier to share resources. :)
I agree on principle... But unfortunately in the StoryBoard experience adopting the same framework as Horizon did not magically make Horizon people invest time improving StoryBoard. All other things being equal, I would indeed recommend alignment on the same framework. But teams existing familiarity with the framework chosen (or ease of learning said chosen framework, or desirable features for the specific use case) probably rank higher in the list of criteria. -- Thierry Carrez (ttx)
Hello! I definitely agree that it would be nice to unify, someday, but like Thierry said, we've tried to use the same framework in the past and it resulted in the team having to learn and start from scratch and resulted in almost no additional help. We talked about all of the pros and cons in our last meeting if you'd like to read it[1]. I was definitely interested in React because of Zuul's use of it, but I know they are a small team themselves and can't expect that they will come help us just because we picked a framework they have experience with. Since we already have a POC in Vue and some of our team members have experience with it, that's what we are going to go with. That said, if there were a handful of contributors that wanted to help us build it in React and volunteered right now, we might be willing to reopen discussion :) - Kendall (diablo_rojo) [1] http://eavesdrop.openstack.org/meetings/storyboard/2021/storyboard.2021-01-2... On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 1:13 AM Thierry Carrez <thierry@openstack.org> wrote:
Adrian Turjak wrote:
[...] I just think that if we stick to one frontend framework for most of OpenStack it can make it easier to share resources. :)
I agree on principle... But unfortunately in the StoryBoard experience adopting the same framework as Horizon did not magically make Horizon people invest time improving StoryBoard.
All other things being equal, I would indeed recommend alignment on the same framework. But teams existing familiarity with the framework chosen (or ease of learning said chosen framework, or desirable features for the specific use case) probably rank higher in the list of criteria.
-- Thierry Carrez (ttx)
participants (10)
-
Adrian Turjak
-
Dmitry Tantsur
-
Jeremy Stanley
-
Kendall Nelson
-
Mark Korondi
-
Michael Johnson
-
Monty Taylor
-
Radosław Piliszek
-
Stephen Finucane
-
Thierry Carrez