Hi All, As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws. http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806.... We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger: 1- There’s consensus on utilizing option 1, thus requiring no bylaws change and merging AUC and ATC : 1- No bylaws change As bylaws changes take a lot of time and energy, the simplest approach would be to merge the TC and UC without changing the bylaws at all. The single body (called TC) would incorporate the AUC criteria by adding all AUC members as extra-ATC. It would tackle all aspects of our community. To respect the letter of the bylaws, the TC would formally designate 5 of its members to be the 'UC' and those would select a 'UC chair'. But all tasks would be handled together. 2- Two main core UC responsibilities need to continue to be represented under TC - Representing the user community to the broader community (Board of directors, TC...) - Working with user groups worldwide to keep the community vibrant and informed. 3- The current active workgroups under UC’s governance will be moved to be under TC’s governance. 4- AUC and ATC to be merged into a single list, potentially called AC (Active Contributor) 5- We hope to have the merger finalized before the upcoming UC elections in September 2020. In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG. Thanks Mohamed --melsakhawy
On 2020-05-07 10:32:42 -0400 (-0400), Mohamed Elsakhawy wrote: [...]
4- AUC and ATC to be merged into a single list, potentially called AC (Active Contributor) [...]
The term Active Technical Contributors (ATC) is referenced officially in OSF Bylaws Appendix 4, so renaming it may not be worth tackling in the immediate future: https://www.openstack.org/legal/technical-committee-member-policy/
In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
Might I recommend an item #6? Move discussions to the openstack-discuss mailing list and retire the separate user-committee ML. The TC already got rid of its dedicated mailing list a couple years back when we merged other extant lists into the then-new general discussion list. I'm happy to assist with doing the same for user-committee since I handled all the others previously. -- Jeremy Stanley
Mohamed Elsakhawy wrote:
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806....
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger: [...]
Thanks Mohamed for the detailed plan. With Jeremy's caveats, it sounds good to me. I'm happy to assist by filing the necessary changes in the various governance repositories.
[...] In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
I added this topic to the etherpad at: https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/tc-victoria-ptg -- Thierry Carrez (ttx)
Is that a recommendation we want to share with other project under OpenStack foundation? -----Original Message----- From: Thierry Carrez <thierry@openstack.org> Sent: Thursday, May 7, 2020 11:00 AM To: Mohamed Elsakhawy; OpenStack Discuss; user-committee Subject: Re: [User-committee] Uniting TC and UC [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Mohamed Elsakhawy wrote:
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/0 12806.html
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger: [...]
Thanks Mohamed for the detailed plan. With Jeremy's caveats, it sounds good to me. I'm happy to assist by filing the necessary changes in the various governance repositories.
[...] In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
I added this topic to the etherpad at: https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/tc-victoria-ptg -- Thierry Carrez (ttx) _______________________________________________ User-committee mailing list User-committee@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/user-committee
OpenStack currently is the only OSF project which has a TC and UC structure. Thanks, Amy (spotz)
On May 7, 2020, at 3:17 PM, Arkady.Kanevsky@dell.com wrote:
Is that a recommendation we want to share with other project under OpenStack foundation?
-----Original Message----- From: Thierry Carrez <thierry@openstack.org> Sent: Thursday, May 7, 2020 11:00 AM To: Mohamed Elsakhawy; OpenStack Discuss; user-committee Subject: Re: [User-committee] Uniting TC and UC
[EXTERNAL EMAIL]
Mohamed Elsakhawy wrote:
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/0 12806.html
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger: [...]
Thanks Mohamed for the detailed plan. With Jeremy's caveats, it sounds good to me. I'm happy to assist by filing the necessary changes in the various governance repositories.
[...] In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
I added this topic to the etherpad at: https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/tc-victoria-ptg
-- Thierry Carrez (ttx)
_______________________________________________ User-committee mailing list User-committee@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/user-committee _______________________________________________ User-committee mailing list User-committee@lists.openstack.org http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/user-committee
On 2020-05-07 20:16:57 +0000 (+0000), Arkady.Kanevsky@dell.com wrote:
Is that a recommendation we want to share with other project under OpenStack foundation? [...]
As far as I'm aware, no other Open Infrastructure Project maintains a separate User Committee, and they already expect their existing governance bodies to take up user-related concerns as a matter of course. -- Jeremy Stanley
On 5/7/2020 11:00 AM, Thierry Carrez wrote:
Mohamed Elsakhawy wrote:
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806....
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger: [...]
Thanks Mohamed for the detailed plan. With Jeremy's caveats, it sounds good to me. I'm happy to assist by filing the necessary changes in the various governance repositories.
[...] In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
I added this topic to the etherpad at: https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/tc-victoria-ptg
I agree. Thanks Mohamed for putting this together. It is consistent with the plan we discussed earlier in the year. Thanks for adding it to the Etherpad ttx. Jay
Thanks all. Regarding the user-committee mailing list, we had a discussion and there's no reason to keep it alive. So it can be merged once the UC/TC merger is done. Thanks, Thierry for adding it to the list. Do we have a specific order that items will be discussed in the TC PTG sessions? On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 1:54 PM Jay S. Bryant <jungleboyj@gmail.com> wrote:
On 5/7/2020 11:00 AM, Thierry Carrez wrote:
Mohamed Elsakhawy wrote:
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806....
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger: [...]
Thanks Mohamed for the detailed plan. With Jeremy's caveats, it sounds good to me. I'm happy to assist by filing the necessary changes in the various governance repositories.
[...] In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
I added this topic to the etherpad at: https://etherpad.opendev.org/p/tc-victoria-ptg
I agree. Thanks Mohamed for putting this together. It is consistent with the plan we discussed earlier in the year.
Thanks for adding it to the Etherpad ttx.
Jay
---- On Thu, 07 May 2020 09:32:42 -0500 Mohamed Elsakhawy <m2elsakha@gmail.com> wrote ----
Hi All,
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806....
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger:
1- There’s consensus on utilizing option 1, thus requiring no bylaws change and merging AUC and ATC :
1- No bylaws change As bylaws changes take a lot of time and energy, the simplest approach would be to merge the TC and UC without changing the bylaws at all. The single body (called TC) would incorporate the AUC criteria by adding all AUC members as extra-ATC. It would tackle all aspects of our community. To respect the letter of the bylaws, the TC would formally designate 5 of its members to be the 'UC' and those would select a 'UC chair'. But all tasks would be handled together.
2- Two main core UC responsibilities need to continue to be represented under TC - Representing the user community to the broader community (Board of directors, TC...)
+1.
- Working with user groups worldwide to keep the community vibrant and informed.
This was one of my main concerns and worry since starting. This is really important which is more of managerial activities and event/group coordination along with OpenStack Ambassadors and IMO does not really fit under TC activities, we may need some other place/team to take care of these tasks. -gmann
3- The current active workgroups under UC’s governance will be moved to be under TC’s governance.
4- AUC and ATC to be merged into a single list, potentially called AC (Active Contributor)
5- We hope to have the merger finalized before the upcoming UC elections in September 2020.
In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
Thanks
Mohamed --melsakhawy
Thanks All, @Jeremy , I don't see a reason for the separate ML to continue to exist, having all discussions in openstack-discuss makes more sense. I'll bring it to the next UC meeting and keep you posted. @Ghanshyam : Part of the proposal is to have "5" designated members under TC to perform the UC duties including UG involvement. I guess that mandates some expansion of current TC activities, but that's a valid point, we may want to discuss further. On Thu, May 7, 2020 at 5:09 PM Ghanshyam Mann <gmann@ghanshyammann.com> wrote:
Hi All,
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with
---- On Thu, 07 May 2020 09:32:42 -0500 Mohamed Elsakhawy < m2elsakha@gmail.com> wrote ---- their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806....
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as
the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger:
1- There’s consensus on utilizing option 1, thus requiring no bylaws
change and merging AUC and ATC :
1- No bylaws change As bylaws changes take a lot of time and energy, the simplest approach
would be to merge the TC and UC without changing the bylaws at all. The single body (called TC) would incorporate the AUC criteria by adding all AUC members as extra-ATC. It would tackle all aspects of our community. To respect the letter of the bylaws, the TC would formally designate 5 of its members to be the 'UC' and those would select a 'UC chair'. But all tasks would be handled together.
2- Two main core UC responsibilities need to continue to be represented
- Representing the user community to the broader community (Board of
under TC directors, TC...)
+1.
- Working with user groups worldwide to keep the community vibrant and informed.
This was one of my main concerns and worry since starting. This is really important which is more of managerial activities and event/group coordination along with OpenStack Ambassadors and IMO does not really fit under TC activities, we may need some other place/team to take care of these tasks.
-gmann
3- The current active workgroups under UC’s governance will be moved to
be under TC’s governance.
4- AUC and ATC to be merged into a single list, potentially called AC
(Active Contributor)
5- We hope to have the merger finalized before the upcoming UC
elections in September 2020.
In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the
opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
Thanks
Mohamed --melsakhawy
Allison Price OpenStack Foundation allison@openstack.org
On May 7, 2020, at 4:09 PM, Ghanshyam Mann <gmann@ghanshyammann.com> wrote:
---- On Thu, 07 May 2020 09:32:42 -0500 Mohamed Elsakhawy <m2elsakha@gmail.com <mailto:m2elsakha@gmail.com>> wrote ----
Hi All,
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806....
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger:
1- There’s consensus on utilizing option 1, thus requiring no bylaws change and merging AUC and ATC :
1- No bylaws change As bylaws changes take a lot of time and energy, the simplest approach would be to merge the TC and UC without changing the bylaws at all. The single body (called TC) would incorporate the AUC criteria by adding all AUC members as extra-ATC. It would tackle all aspects of our community. To respect the letter of the bylaws, the TC would formally designate 5 of its members to be the 'UC' and those would select a 'UC chair'. But all tasks would be handled together.
2- Two main core UC responsibilities need to continue to be represented under TC - Representing the user community to the broader community (Board of directors, TC...)
+1.
- Working with user groups worldwide to keep the community vibrant and informed.
This was one of my main concerns and worry since starting. This is really important which is more of managerial activities and event/group coordination along with OpenStack Ambassadors and IMO does not really fit under TC activities, we may need some other place/team to take care of these tasks.
Helping user groups and ambassadors is actually something that the OpenStack Foundation staff has dedicated resources for, so I don’t think that it’s something that the TC needs to worry about incorporating into their activities or setting up another team.
-gmann
3- The current active workgroups under UC’s governance will be moved to be under TC’s governance.
4- AUC and ATC to be merged into a single list, potentially called AC (Active Contributor)
5- We hope to have the merger finalized before the upcoming UC elections in September 2020.
In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
Thanks
Mohamed --melsakhawy
---- On Fri, 08 May 2020 10:08:40 -0500 Allison Price <allison@openstack.org> wrote ----
Allison PriceOpenStack Foundationallison@openstack.org
On May 7, 2020, at 4:09 PM, Ghanshyam Mann <gmann@ghanshyammann.com> wrote: ---- On Thu, 07 May 2020 09:32:42 -0500 Mohamed Elsakhawy <m2elsakha@gmail.com> wrote ---- Hi All,
As you may know already, there has been an ongoing discussion to merge UC and TC under a single body. Three options were presented, along with their impact on the bylaws.
http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-discuss/2020-February/012806....
We had several discussions in the UC on the three options as well as the UC items that need to be well-represented under the common committee, and here’s what we propose for the merger:
1- There’s consensus on utilizing option 1, thus requiring no bylaws change and merging AUC and ATC :
1- No bylaws change As bylaws changes take a lot of time and energy, the simplest approach would be to merge the TC and UC without changing the bylaws at all. The single body (called TC) would incorporate the AUC criteria by adding all AUC members as extra-ATC. It would tackle all aspects of our community. To respect the letter of the bylaws, the TC would formally designate 5 of its members to be the 'UC' and those would select a 'UC chair'. But all tasks would be handled together.
2- Two main core UC responsibilities need to continue to be represented under TC - Representing the user community to the broader community (Board of directors, TC...)
+1.
- Working with user groups worldwide to keep the community vibrant and informed.
This was one of my main concerns and worry since starting. This is really important which is more of managerial activities and event/group coordination along with OpenStack Ambassadors and IMO does not really fit under TC activities, we may need some other place/team to take care of these tasks.
Helping user groups and ambassadors is actually something that the OpenStack Foundation staff has dedicated resources for, so I don’t think that it’s something that the TC needs to worry about incorporating into their activities or setting up another team.
Thanks, Allison for updates. That is much helpful for this merge. -gmann
-gmann
3- The current active workgroups under UC’s governance will be moved to be under TC’s governance.
4- AUC and ATC to be merged into a single list, potentially called AC (Active Contributor)
5- We hope to have the merger finalized before the upcoming UC elections in September 2020.
In addition to discussions over the mailing list, we also have the opportunity of "face-to-face" discussions at the upcoming PTG.
Thanks
Mohamed --melsakhawy
participants (8)
-
Allison Price
-
Amy
-
Arkady.Kanevsky＠dell.com
-
Ghanshyam Mann
-
Jay S. Bryant
-
Jeremy Stanley
-
Mohamed Elsakhawy
-
Thierry Carrez