So if I understand correctly, this says to me that Openstack is never intended to be consumed by end users.
Is this correct? no there are many end user that deploy there openstack directly from source or using comunity installer project. as an opensouce project developer of the project will try to help our end user fix there own problems by explain how things work and
On Sat, 2020-01-18 at 14:48 +0800, Tony Pearce wrote: pointing them in the right direction. If a user reports a ligitimate bug we will try to fix it eventually when our day job allows. But the same way the mysql develpers wont provdie 1:1 support for tuneing your db deployment for your workload the openstack communtiy does nto provide deployment planning or day 2 operation supprot to customers. we obviously try to make day 2 operation eaiser and if user report pain point we take that on board but if you choose to deploy openstack directly from source or community distributions without a vendor then you are relying on the good will of indiviuals. i and other do help end users when they ask genuine questions providing links ot the relevnet docs or pointing them to config optins or presentaiton on the topic they ask about. we will also somtime help diagnose problem the people are having, but if that good will is abused then i will go back to my day job. if you show up and demand that we drop everything and fix your problem now you will likely have a negitive experience. unlike a vendor relationship we dont have a professional/paid relationship with our end users, on the other hand if you show up, get involved and help other where you can then i think you will find most people in the comunity will try to help you too when you need it. that is one of the big cultural difference between an opensouce project and a support product. a project is a comunity of people working together to advance a common goal. a product on the ohter hand has a businesses promise of support and with that an expectation that your vendor will go beyond good will if your business is impacted by an issue with there product. if you chose to deploy openstack as an end user understand that while we try to make that easy, the learning curvy is high and you need to have the right skills to make it a success but you can certenly do that if you invest the time and peopel to do it. kolla-ansible and openstack ansible provide two of the simplest comunity installer for managing openstack. as installer projects there focus is on day 1 and day 2 operations and tend to have more operators involved the component projects. while you can role your own they have already centralised the knoladge of may operators in the solutions they have developed so i would recommend reaching out to them to learn how you can deploy openstack your self. if you want a product as other said then you should reach out to your vendor of choice and they will help you with both planning your deployment and keeping it running.
Regards
On Sat, 18 Jan 2020, 11:28 Mohammed Naser, <mnaser@vexxhost.com> wrote:
On Fri, Jan 17, 2020 at 1:42 PM Jeremy Stanley <fungi@yuggoth.org> wrote:
On 2020-01-17 21:24:36 +0530 (+0530), Adam Peacock wrote: [...]
Also, we need to be clear not everyone leans towards being a developer or even *wants* to go in that direction when using OpenStack. In fact, most don't and if there is that expectation by those entrenched with the OpenStack product, the OpenStack option gets dropped in favor of something else. It's developer-friendly but we need to be mega-mega-careful, as a community, to ensure development isn't the baseline or assumption for adequate support or to get questions answered. Especially since we've converged our communication channels.
[...]
Most users probably won't become developers on OpenStack, but some will, and I believe its long-term survival depends on that so we should do everything we can to encourage it. Users may also contribute in a variety of other ways like bug reporting and triage, outreach, revising or translating documentation, and so on.
OpenStack isn't a "product," it's a community software collaboration on which many companies have built products (either by running it as a service or selling support for it). Treating the community the way you might treat a paid vendor is where all of this goes to a bad place very quickly.
We've probably strayed a bit far away from the original topic, but I echo this thought very much.
OpenStack is a project. $your_favorite_vendor's OpenStack is a product. It's important for us to keep that distinction for the success of both the project and vendors IMHO.
-- Jeremy Stanley
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