[Women-of-openstack] How many software devs?
Claire Massey
claire at openstack.org
Thu Nov 5 15:34:10 UTC 2015
Hi there,
Here’s the breakdown of roles of women attendees at the Tokyo Summit:
- 26% - Developer
- 21% - Business Development / Marketing
- 18% - Other
- 15% - Product Strategy / Management / Architect
- 14% - Operator / User / Operations SysAdmin
- 6% - CEO / CIO / IT Manager
Best,
Claire
> On Nov 4, 2015, at 9:40 PM, Claire Massey <claire at openstack.org> wrote:
>
> Hi there,
>
> As Anne just mentioned the Summit attendee demographics are not a comprehensive way to capture data points that fully represent the OpenStack community. Many active community members are unable to attend the Summits.
>
> The data that I previously shared was specific to women ATC attendees at the Tokyo Summit because Nithya’s original topic (at the bottom of this thread) specifically mentioned that people are inquiring how many women are contributing code to OpenStack and referenced the picture from the Tokyo Summit.
>
> However, if you are more broadly wanting to know the quantity of women Tokyo Summit attendees who have technical roles, whether or not they are contributing code and have the ATC designation, then we can pull that data for you. It will just take me some time to cull through, but we can do it.
>
> All Tokyo Summit attendees who registered online were asked to provide their organizational role and select one or more of the following options. Many people selected more than one option.
> - Developer
> - OpenStack User
> - Operations / SysAdmin
> - CIO / CTO / IT Manager
> - Business Development / Marketing
> - CEO / Executive Leadership
> - Product Strategy / Management / Architect
> - Media
> - Other
>
> I can cull through the Tokyo Summit data to share the percentages of women attendees who self identify with these categories.
>
> For reference, here is the breakdown of roles across all Tokyo Summit attendees (men and women combined):
> - 28% - Developer
> - 25% - Operator / User / Operations SysAdmin
> - 19% - Product Strategy / Management / Architect
> - 11% - Business Development / Marketing
> - 10% - CEO / CIO / IT Manager
> - 7% - Other
>
> Best,
> Claire
>
>
>> On Nov 4, 2015, at 9:04 PM, Claire Delcourt <claire at nuagenetworks.net <mailto:claire at nuagenetworks.net>> wrote:
>>
>> Yes, so basically the interest to have those statistics is there but there is no accurate way today of guessing the gender from a github profile.
>>
>> Regarding the OS Summit Statistics, from what I understood from Claire Massey's email is that we have the participants gender but not their role, so in that case it is the role that is missing and has to be "guessed" (for ex using the number of ATC badges to determine the number of code contributors).
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 3:45 PM, Anne Gentle <annegentle at justwriteclick.com <mailto:annegentle at justwriteclick.com>> wrote:
>> Have to change the thread since I'm a word nerd. :)
>>
>> On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 4:34 PM, Claire Delcourt <claire at nuagenetworks.net <mailto:claire at nuagenetworks.net>> wrote:
>> I don't think the intend was to say that the SW developers are the only real contributors (besides I personally don't think that SW developer is the only technical role in the OpenStack community).
>>
>> If I understand correctly the various reactions, it is a matter of rephrasing the question to something like "how many SW developers are female developers?". That is a valid question to me, and more generally having statistics about the various roles that the women of OpenStack have in the community is interesting.
>>
>> The answer is more complex than you might imagine. We've used some scripts since 2013 or so, with a gender-guessing algorithm based on first name. It isn't very accurate for our community because it was using US census data to match names to gender, for example. [1]
>>
>> Using something like Stackalytics REST API and a Python script with again, the gender guesser that I don't like, shows there are more unknown genders than men, based on name guessing. [2]
>>
>> Liberty:
>> females: 157
>> males: 870
>> unknown: 985
>>
>> Kilo:
>> females: 135
>> males: 778
>> unknown: 829
>>
>> I don't really like any of these counting devices because it's ignoring, say, Asian and Indian first-name-gender-guessing, and diversity means diversity across many viewpoints.
>>
>> I'll also note that for me, event attendance is a poor counting device for activity of women and minorities especially, since it can be more difficult to achieve escape velocity for various reasons, caretaking, budgeting, location proximity, shifting priorities, and so on.
>>
>> I hope that info gives you a little more background. Please tell me if I'm incorrect in any of the explanations. This is a good discussion, thanks for having it.
>>
>> Anne
>>
>> 1. http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-April/007288.html <http://lists.openstack.org/pipermail/openstack-dev/2013-April/007288.html>
>> 2. https://github.com/openfly/openstack-gender <https://github.com/openfly/openstack-gender>
>>
>>
>>
>> Claire
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 3:07 PM, Anne Gentle <annegentle at justwriteclick.com <mailto:annegentle at justwriteclick.com>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 10:23 AM, Foley, Emma L <emma.l.foley at intel.com <mailto:emma.l.foley at intel.com>> wrote:
>> I have nothing against non-technical people, and I meant no offence, but I'm looking at it from a different point-of-view than you are. Maybe my view is skewed, as the majority of the men I met were technical, and it seemed that the majority of the women I met were not technical. I got the feeling that technical women were highly underrepresented at the summit. I don't know what the over-all statistics were for technical/non-technical male/female overall, but I just saw the women as a majority non-technical group, and while there's nothing wrong with that, it would leave me feeling that being a technical women puts me in much more of a minority than I thought. i.e. I was expecting to find women in a similar role to myself.
>>
>> It might also be to do with the fact that I expected a lot more technical people overall, as that is where I'm coming from, working in a technical team in a large company, where marketing and other non-technical people are kept separate to a great extent.
>>
>> TLDR; My previous experience does not include a huge amount of collaboration with non-tech people, which skewed my expectations.
>>
>>
>> Glad you expanded upon your experiences. Let me give you some more perspective if I may.
>>
>> There's good reason to be concerned about some sort of call-out in amount of technical-ness of any individual contributor. We're unfortunately in an industry where this practice continues to shove women in to a category that's considered "lesser." I'd recommend this article:
>> https://modelviewculture.com/pieces/c-is-manly-python-is-for-n00bs-how-false-stereotypes-turn-into-technical-truths <https://modelviewculture.com/pieces/c-is-manly-python-is-for-n00bs-how-false-stereotypes-turn-into-technical-truths>
>>
>> Pull quotes that really spoke to me:
>> * "A major reason to eradicate these false stereotypes is that they perpetuate biases against women."
>> * "While those on the outside are still struggling to prove themselves, the technically privileged have gone ahead to determine what the software that runs our lives should look like."
>> * "Judgments about language use, despite being far from “objective” or “technical,” set up a hierarchy among programmers that systematically privileges certain groups."
>>
>> I've been more aware of the loss of power or privilege by choosing to be in an "other" category since my focus is documentation. It happens to be highly technical, but people often overlook or even look down upon it as a contribution. Same for "oh you're a database administrator" or "oh, you are a web developer." Be very careful if you notice you take on those biases because of the industry we work in. Our industry is terrible at this categorization and stereotype creation, and it shows. We're working on making it better and this conversation is a good starting point.
>>
>> Anne
>>
>>
>> In general:
>> Tech people engage with tech people as they know the product on a different level to non-technical people. Same goes for non-tech, the marketing guy is not going to want to talk to the kernel engineer when talking about (e.g.) the newest distro, they'll just want to know about a feature at a high level, and not how many lines of code and what algorithms were used to implement the feature.
>>
>> To address the problem of people being disappointed at meeting a marketing person at a booth:
>> A technical person is going to want to talk tech, and will be expecting technical person (as well as marketing) to be available to answer their technical questions. I'm not saying a marketing person wouldn't be able to answer these, but the tech person would be better qualified to discuss the highly technical stuff, as it would be their area of expertise.
>>
>> So don't be offended if I want to talk tech with other technical people, and was disappointed that I didn't find as many as I was expecting in the group. Any non-technical person would feel lost in a room of engineers.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Emma
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>> Intel Shannon Limited
>> Registered in Ireland
>> Registered Office: Collinstown Industrial Park, Leixlip, County Kildare
>> Registered Number: 308263
>> Business address: Dromore House, East Park, Shannon, Co. Clare
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Niki Acosta (nikacost) [mailto:nikacost at cisco.com <mailto:nikacost at cisco.com>]
>> Sent: Tuesday, November 3, 2015 3:54 PM
>> To: Foley, Emma L; women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org <mailto:women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org>
>> Subject: Re: [Women-of-openstack] Meeting today
>>
>> This bums me out. Maybe I¹m taking this personally, but being ³disappointed" and following that with ³at least 50% of the women I met were in non-technical roles² makes it seem like women (like myself) are somehow less valuable or important because we¹re not technical contributors. Perhaps that is not your intent. Nevertheless, I wanted to share some thoughts on this subject, as it¹s come up quite a bit.
>>
>> During a past summit, someone made a comment in a panel that they were ³offended² that someone came to the booth and thought they were ³in marketing.² A few women in the room took offense to that statement, and I understood why. It was as though marketers were somehow less important and less valuable than contributors and developers. A woman in the audience stood up, walked to the mic, and asked folks to stop saying ³they thought I was in marketing like it¹s a bad thing.² She was right. That exchange made me realize that subconscious bias exists even amongst women in the same group.
>>
>> As women, we should support each other!
>>
>> If it weren¹t for the brilliant women (and men) of OpenStack who share their expertise around public relations, social media, marketing, business development, branding, copywriting, communications, analyst relations, event planning, presentation authoring/coaching, and probably a whole lot of other stuff that I¹m probably forgetting, what would OpenStack look like? There would be no summit. There would be no Women of OpenStack events. There would be no SuperUser magazine or newsletter.There would be no ³We Are OpenStack² campaign. OpenStack would NOT EXIST.
>>
>> At then end of each day, we¹re all human. We all have different skills, different talents, and different abilities. The cool part is that people from all around the globe are building something that is fundamentally changing humanity< something bigger than ourselves. And while the code and docs are created by technical contributors, the other side of OpenStack keeps that foundation strong and vibrant and growing. And that¹s pretty cool.
>>
>> Apologies if this offended anyone. That definitely was not my intent. My intent is to help us be more inclusive and embrace diversity< no matter what is printed on your badge.
>>
>> #WeAreOpenStack
>>
>> Niki Acosta
>> Cloud Evangelist
>> (t) @nikiacosta
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11/3/15, 5:51 AM, "Foley, Emma L" <emma.l.foley at intel.com <mailto:emma.l.foley at intel.com>> wrote:
>>
>> >I agree, while there was a record number of women attendees , I was
>> >disappointed by the low number of women technical contributors! At
>> >least 50% of the women I met were in non-technical roles.
>> >
>> >I did meet some great people there, but I was expecting many more
>> >female ATCs, when there was a big fuss about the large number of women attending.
>> >
>> >Regards,
>> >Emma
>> >
>> >________________________________________
>> >
>> >
>> >Date: Mon, 2 Nov 2015 16:30:08 +0000
>> >From: Nithya Ruff <Nithya.Ruff at sandisk.com <mailto:Nithya.Ruff at sandisk.com>>
>> >To: "Barrett, Carol L" <carol.l.barrett at intel.com <mailto:carol.l.barrett at intel.com>>, Amy Marrich
>> > <Amy.Marrich at rackspace.com <mailto:Amy.Marrich at rackspace.com>>,
>> >"women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org <mailto:women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org>"
>> > <women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org <mailto:women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org>>
>> >Subject: Re: [Women-of-openstack] Meeting today
>> >Message-ID:
>> >
>> ><BL2PR02MB4209D531715A9D9FBB94BD6F62C0 at BL2PR02MB420.namprd02.prod.outlook <mailto:BL2PR02MB4209D531715A9D9FBB94BD6F62C0 at BL2PR02MB420.namprd02.prod.outlook>.
>> >com>
>> >
>> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> >
>> >I would like to suggest an agenda item for next week's meeting . When
>> >I retweeted the Women of OpenStack picture, I got a number of questions
>> >on how many of the women in OpenStack are developers contributing code.
>> >They want role models in the community.
>> > Bitergia is a company that OpenStack foundation uses to create the
>> >stats behind "the state of OpenStack". Why not work with them on getting more
>> >information on women contributing patches to the various projects. I
>> >would like to suggest we discuss this next time.
>> >
>> >Beth, Carol and Jessica - thanks again for your leadership and all the
>> >work that the foundation does - Claire and others to make this a
>> >thriving community.
>> >
>> >Thank You,
>> >Nithya A. Ruff, Director, SanDisk Open Source Strategy Office WIN
>> >Board Member SanDisk Corporation
>> >951 SanDisk Drive, Milpitas, CA 95035
>> >T: + (408-801-7068 <tel:%28408-801-7068>)| M: + (510-378-3159 <tel:%28510-378-3159>)
>> >Nithya.Ruff at SanDisk.com <mailto:Nithya.Ruff at SanDisk.com><mailto:Nithya.Ruff at SanDisk.com <mailto:Nithya.Ruff at SanDisk.com>> Twitter:
>> >@nithyaruff<https://twitter.com/nithyaruff <https://twitter.com/nithyaruff>>
>> >
>> >_______________________________________________
>> >Women-of-openstack mailing list
>> >Women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org <mailto:Women-of-openstack at lists.openstack.org>
>> >http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/women-of-openstack <http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/women-of-openstack>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>> --
>> Anne Gentle
>> Rackspace
>> Principal Engineer
>> www.justwriteclick.com <http://www.justwriteclick.com/>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Anne Gentle
>> Rackspace
>> Principal Engineer
>> www.justwriteclick.com <http://www.justwriteclick.com/>
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