<br><tt><font size=2>Mark McLoughlin wrote on 05/08/2012 10:58:45 AM:<br>
<br>
...<br>
> What I'd like to see us get to is:<br>
> <br>
> Deep overlap between the OpenStack developer community and
the<br>
> community of folks drafting whatever IaaS standard(s) wind
up being<br>
> dominant.<br>
> <br>
> e.g. prominent, active Nova developers developers contributing
to the <br>
> CIMI or OCCI standards and bringing the needs of OpenStack
to the <br>
> standard and bringing ideas from the standards process to OpenStack.<br>
> <br>
> This isn't a question of asking existing OpenStack developers to join<br>
> these standards bodies. It's about enabling members of those standards<br>
> bodies to become as much a part of OpenStack as any other developer.<br>
> <br>
> How to do that? Encourage members the various standards communities
to<br>
> actively contribute an implementation of their standard to OpenStack<br>
> and, more importantly, stick around to become an ongoing active member<br>
> of the OpenStack developer community.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>While the issue of "what goes into the core vs
is a plug-in" is certainly</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>an important one, I think the above touches on a higher-order
issue that</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>I think is just as important. And it's around
the proliferation of IaaS APIs.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>Certainly each IaaS author is going to favor their
own APIs - as expected.</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>As a result there will be resistance to adopt, or
even look at, others.</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>They will also try to push their favorite IaaS API
on others.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>In the end though, and this may be hard for some to
believe :-), it's just</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>an API. What matters more is the functionality
behind the APIs.</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>E.g. we all have our favorite API to mock and yet
there are people out</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>there using it. Why? Because they want the features
behind it despite any</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>odd use of HTTP/REST.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>One of the first things we noticed in our CIMI work
was that pretty much</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>every IaaS input contribution was basically the same
- not syntactically</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>but semantically. This made our lives so much
easier. It's also evidenced </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>by the fact that adapter projects (like DeltaCloud)
can exist. If there wasn't</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>semantic similarities between all of those IaaS providers
then I doubt</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>DC would be able to work.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>So, why am I bringing this up? Because while
I agree with Mark that getting</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>standards folks into OS is a good idea, I think having
it be a good two-way</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>communication is even better. Meaning, I think
it would be good for Nova</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>folks to find a way to influence the standards too.
Just as I'm sure</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>some Nova guys are already running from their keyboards
at the prospect of</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>talking to standards weenies :-) I know there
are plenty of standards folks</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>who will never join Openstack (for a variety of technical
and business reasons).</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>Yet for the sake of the broader community I think
we need to find a way to make </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>them work together.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>Additionally, and now the hard part, I think it would
be good for people to </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>realize that there is a spot in the middle where both
sides can meet. Having</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>looked at a variety of IaaS APIs, and more recently
looking at how CIMI can map</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>to Nova, I'm (again) struck at how similar they are.
And if I were to play</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>God for a moment, I'd slap both sides upside their
heads and tell them to </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>each bend a little and find a spot in the middle.
CIMI can change, and Nova</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>can change - after all, it's just an API. </font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>With the recent folks that joined Openstack, the amount
of overlap between</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>CIMI authors and Openstack members is actually quite
large. Just off the top </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>of my head (and this is just me talking, I have no
idea how any of these folks</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>feel about this), but there's RedHat, HP, Rackspace,
IBM, Cisco, Dell and</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>I'm sure others. I'm pretty sure that folks
from those companies would be willing</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>to help bridge the communications between the standards
folks and the Openstack</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>folks - thus allowing the OS devs who want to avoid
standards bodies to do</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>so, but still have a voice over there. Or at
least, speaking just for myself,</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>I'd be more than happy to work to make that happen
- been doing it already</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>for a while behind the scenes.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>But course, this would require at least some commitment
from the various</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>Openstack groups to entertain the idea of this collaboration.
At a minimum</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>it means both sides being willing to see what the
other has and to offer </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>suggestions on how to find that middle ground. I'd
be more than willing to </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>help get those harmonization discussions going but
only if there's interest.</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>May not be the easiest thing, but I also don't see
it is as that hard either, </font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>once a decision to explore that option is made. Just
my 2 cents...</font></tt>
<br>
<br><tt><font size=2>-Doug Davis</font></tt>
<br><tt><font size=2>dug@us.ibm.com</font></tt>
<br>