<div dir="ltr"><div>Folks,</div><div><br></div><div>Sorry for the top post - Those of you that are still at PTG, please feel free to drop in to the Clear Creek room today.</div><div><br></div>Thanks,<div>Dims<br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Thu, Sep 13, 2018 at 2:44 PM Jeremy Stanley <<a href="mailto:fungi@yuggoth.org">fungi@yuggoth.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On 2018-09-12 17:50:30 -0600 (-0600), Matt Riedemann wrote:<br>
[...]<br>
> Again, I'm not saying TC members should be doing all of the work<br>
> themselves. That's not realistic, especially when critical parts<br>
> of any major effort are going to involve developers from projects<br>
> on which none of the TC members are active contributors (e.g.<br>
> nova). I want to see TC members herd cats, for lack of a better<br>
> analogy, and help out technically (with code) where possible.<br>
<br>
I can respect that. I think that OpenStack made a mistake in naming<br>
its community management governance body the "technical" committee.<br>
I do agree that having TC members engage in activities with tangible<br>
outcomes is preferable, and that the needs of the users of its<br>
software should weigh heavily in prioritization decisions, but those<br>
are not the only problems our community faces nor is it as if there<br>
are no other responsibilities associated with being a TC member.<br>
<br>
> Given the repeated mention of how the "help wanted" list continues<br>
> to not draw in contributors, I think the recruiting role of the TC<br>
> should take a back seat to actually stepping in and helping work<br>
> on those items directly. For example, Sean McGinnis is taking an<br>
> active role in the operators guide and other related docs that<br>
> continue to be discussed at every face to face event since those<br>
> docs were dropped from openstack-manuals (in Pike).<br>
<br>
I completely agree that the help wanted list hasn't worked out well<br>
in practice. It was based on requests from the board of directors to<br>
provide some means of communicating to their business-focused<br>
constituency where resources would be most useful to the project.<br>
We've had a subsequent request to reorient it to be more like a set<br>
of job descriptions along with clearer business use cases explaining<br>
the benefit to them of contributing to these efforts. In my opinion<br>
it's very much the responsibility of the TC to find ways to<br>
accomplish these sorts of things as well.<br>
<br>
> I think it's fair to say that the people generally elected to the<br>
> TC are those most visible in the community (it's a popularity<br>
> contest) and those people are generally the most visible because<br>
> they have the luxury of working upstream the majority of their<br>
> time. As such, it's their duty to oversee and spend time working<br>
> on the hard cross-project technical deliverables that operators<br>
> and users are asking for, rather than think of an infinite number<br>
> of ways to try and draw *others* to help work on those gaps.<br>
<br>
But not everyone who is funded for full-time involvement with the<br>
community is necessarily "visible" in ways that make them electable.<br>
Higher-profile involvement in such activities over time is what gets<br>
them the visibility to be more easily elected to governance<br>
positions via "popularity contest" mechanics.<br>
<br>
> As I think it's the role of a PTL within a given project to have a<br>
> finger on the pulse of the technical priorities of that project<br>
> and manage the developers involved (of which the PTL certainly may<br>
> be one), it's the role of the TC to do the same across openstack<br>
> as a whole. If a PTL doesn't have the time or willingness to do<br>
> that within their project, they shouldn't be the PTL. The same<br>
> goes for TC members IMO.<br>
<br>
Completely agree, I think we might just disagree on where to strike<br>
the balance of purely technical priorities for the TC (as I<br>
personally think the TC is somewhat incorrectly named).<br>
-- <br>
Jeremy Stanley<br>
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</blockquote></div><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Davanum Srinivas :: <a href="https://twitter.com/dims" target="_blank">https://twitter.com/dims</a></div></div></div>