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<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">Hi Tom,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">You asked me to write "<b>what else you'd like to see</b>", and I'm really pleased if I can help
</span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:Wingdings">J</span><span lang="EN-US"> !<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">Premise: I'm actually working in a research center in Munich, Germany, and my aim is to provide an Openstack+quantum Cloud platform to researchers to test new algorithms to orchestrate and manage a Software Defined
Networks (SDN), I guess that this leads to face problems that are of general interest, so I guess and hope that all my issues and needs could be useful, at least as stimulus for the documentation roadmap<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">These are the main issues that I’m facing:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">1) quickly get your system working:<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">You need an installation guide, in our case that was a problem because we DO NEED an installation WITH quantum and an openflow-compatible plugin AND, ad I mentioned to the mailing list in a previous post there is no
trace of this in the actual documentation! <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">The “general interest” point here is that it’s always more common for the user the need to create a “real world” datacenter, with complex network structure, so it starts to be mandatory to have a clear openstack+quantum
installation guide…I found very useful this guides, that a user in openstack list did gave me:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><a href="https://github.com/mseknibilel/OpenStack-Grizzly-Install-Guide"><span lang="EN-US">https://github.com/mseknibilel/OpenStack-Grizzly-Install-Guide</span></a>
<span lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">NOTE: often you need to first install and try openstack even with few resources…and then apply for more….this means that the initial guides should always involve the less possible number of servers and (real) NICs/subnets,
honestly a “startup” guide that do involve 3 servers and three subnets is out of scope for a beginner
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">My personal suggestion is to start from this drafts to build new official installation guides<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">Note: don’t you forget a comprehensive collections of example configuration files, each file with with ALL the parameters (even the default one, to let user have an overall control)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">2) provide a brief guide for most common operations<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">In my opinion this exists but should be improved: this is a list of thing a common user should be lead to normally do:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">->Create his/her own user<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">->create his/her own tenant<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">->establish correct user role for what he/she has to do<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">->create and modify networks/subnets/routers + modifying routers to reach a real network (WITH simple example of floating IP)<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">->creating and modifying security groups (at least to ping and ssh)<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">->finally boot a machine, access that and (why not) interact with another VM<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">NOTE: I saw the web interface (horizon) has really increased in terms of functionalities, so examples should me made either with prompt commands and on web interface<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">NOTE: all the commands should be coherent with item 1: ideally the user should start operation guide just after finishing installing<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">3) provide a brief guide for API access (python + java)<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">Once you have your system working and users starts to get in touch you are immediately asked by users to access system via API, and they want just CLEAR and SIMPLE CODE examples to do via code/API what they learned
to do via API, particularly:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">-> create and modify networks/subnets/routers + modifying routers to reach a real network (WITH simple example of floating IP)<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">-> boot VMs, access those and un customized scripts<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">NOTE: In my personal experience the most used languages are Python and Java, personally I would recommend these languages for the documentation examples, but the important point is that all the examples should be made
in at least a couple of languages<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">NOTE: personally I like very much the API structure in openstack because it only deals with URL (endpoint) and http/POST calls sending json files, SO I add a very personal suggestion: wouldn’t it be possible to always
START from examples that use curl in linux (AND something similar in Win or mac) to do things???, in this way we will be educating the user to “call” openstack API “DIRECTLY”, without any “logical connection” to a specific development language<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">For this we should first provide json files examples, usable either with curl, python, java or whatever…<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">4) Extend your system<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">Finally, when everything works, you will surely need to “extend” your system, for instance adding compute nodes, splitting the controller services on more servers, or even adding the object storage (swift) that you
did not use in first steps.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">In my opinion the “advanced” installation guides should start from this assumptions: in these cases you never start from the scratch, you are just extending a system SO we should simply add some Appendixes to the main
installation guides to explain this by examples too (i.e.: appendix 1: “adding a compute node”, appendix 2 “empowering controller” etc etc).
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><b><span lang="EN-US">NOTE: HOPE I HAVE BEEN USEFUL AND DID NOT BOTHER ANYONE<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">Best Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">Marco<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span lang="EN-US">-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Tom Fifield [mailto:tom@openstack.org] <br>
Sent: den 7 oktober 2013 12:37<br>
To: Marco Fornaro; openstack-docs@lists.openstack.org<br>
Subject: Re: [Openstack-docs] HELP! guide "openstack-compute-api-with-shell-and-python"</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Thanks Marco, really appreciate the feedback - I think it's very valid.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Do you have a moment to write what else you'd like to see? I think we're
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">planning to make a new book/make some updates specifically for the kind
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">of adventure you're on now ...<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">On 07/10/13 20:23, Marco Fornaro wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Hi Tom,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Thanks very much for your help and for the URL<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> I will take in count your considerations about the not-up-to-date guide<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> BUT..in general I could not find another simple tutorial that could lead to create/boot/destroy a VM...the quick start guide IS NOT in my opinion: because only the CLI commands are used in the example...I mean not even an example for
booting a machine using a json file and curl and/or python script or whatever...<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> If you have some alternative tutorial to suggest you're welcome!<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> BR<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Marco<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> -----Original Message-----<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> From: Tom Fifield [mailto:tom@openstack.org]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Sent: den 7 oktober 2013 09:15<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> To: openstack-docs@lists.openstack.org<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Subject: Re: [Openstack-docs] HELP! guide "openstack-compute-api-with-shell-and-python"<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> If you really still want it -- and do take care: it's probably going to<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> cause a lot of pain if you try to use it -- you can find it at:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> https://github.com/openstack/api-site/blob/7ff099be64ab58bce13a10f7dd7ca5807ce4618b/openstack-api-programming/openstack-api-programming.md<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Tom<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> On 07/10/13 18:12, Tom Fifield wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> Hi,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> That guide was very outdated and in many cases simply wrong for the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> current releases of OpenStack - especially the examples.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> Do you really still want it?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> Tom<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> On 07/10/13 18:09, Marco Fornaro wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> Hi All,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> To get practice in interfacing to Openstack API I read a manual that was<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> linked from openstack official documentation main page, this was the<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> link:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> http://docs.openstack.org/api/openstack-compute/programmer/content/programming-openstack-compute-api-with-shell-and-python-1st-ed..html<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> I found that guide very useful especially for the many practical<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> examples in there, either for shell or for python<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> now, clicking that page I am redirected to:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> http://docs.openstack.org/api/quick-start/content/<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> Does anyone know WHY that link is now redirected to the quick start<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> guide (a different document)?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> Is it still possible to access the original guide?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> Best Regards<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> Marco<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> _______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> Openstack-docs mailing list<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> Openstack-docs@lists.openstack.org<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>> http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-docs<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> _______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> Openstack-docs mailing list<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> Openstack-docs@lists.openstack.org<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">>> http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-docs<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> _______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Openstack-docs mailing list<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> Openstack-docs@lists.openstack.org<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">> http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-docs<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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