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<div name="messageReplySection">On 5 Mar 2020, 02:57 +0700, Jay Bryant <jungleboyj@gmail.com>, wrote:<br />
<br />
<blockquote type="cite" class="spark_quote" style="margin: 5px 5px; padding-left: 10px; border-left: thin solid #1abc9c;">Zane's input sums up how I feel as well. I think that having consistent<br />
leadership structure across projects is important and helps keep us<br />
aware of the health of projects.<br />
<br />
Perhaps we can help return interest in the PTL role by providing<br />
examples of teams that share the work and have the PTL to help make<br />
final decisions. I know that the Cinder team has been doing this for<br />
quite some time successfully. <br /></blockquote>
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<div dir="auto">I really fail to understand the issue of an overwhelming PTLship. From my</div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">personal 5+ experience of being a PTL, I can say I’ve never tried to do all</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">stuff like releases, fixing CI, back porting etc. etc. myself. Especially given</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">that I really like solving technical problems, I always try to offload some of</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">these duties to others and make sure I have time for development. And</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">IMO it’s totally fine. As a PTL I try to make sure that everyone in the team</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">(at least most active members) has this balance between problem solving</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">and necessary procedures. I absolutely agree though that as the PTL <b>I have</b></span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);"><b>to know</b> what’s going on with the project and after all TC or someone else</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">can ask me about its current state and progress.</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">Of course, I</span><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);"> realise that </span><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">my project is somewhat </span><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">not really typical for</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">OpenStack: it is relatively small and has not so </span><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">many connections with other</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">projects. But I believe this principle is universal </span><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">enough.</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">As far as the PTL role, I think for PTLs it’s important to focus on the big</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">picture, ideas and directions and keep reminding everyone about that.</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">All team members, even active ones, often </span><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">can’t afford thinking about this</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">too much. This contradicts with lots of what I heard before from my former</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">managers and colleagues, and also some PTLs I know. They claimed:</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">“PTLs just need to maintain Launchpad (or Storyboard), keep an eye</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">on the release process and that’s basically it. Plus reviewing a little bit.”</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">I’ve always shrugged when hearing this.. If so, let’s remove “L” from “PTL”</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">and replace it with “A”, so that it’s “PTA” - Project Technical Administrator.</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">Something that can legally exist, no issue. And it’s more honest.</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">What I’m going to is, from my perspective, it probably doesn’t make any</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">difference if a project leader is an official role or not. I guess there will</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">always </span><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">be someone who naturally gains trust of others and influences</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">the direction of a project. As far as “having a final word on a deadlocked</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">issue” I thought this is something really important but, in fact, it’s a</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">very rare thing and may not be needed at all. Usually, we have to make</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">a decision anyway, since “not making a decision is more expensive than</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">making even bad decision”.</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);"><br /></span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">So I believe some leadership is always needed. The most high quality</span></div>
<div dir="auto">techs I’ve ever seen have been all made with a very strong leadership,</div>
<div dir="auto">I don’t believe it works the other way. Whether it’s official or not, I think</div>
<div dir="auto">is not important at all. But “administrative duties” that <span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">often assign to</span></div>
<div dir="auto"><span style="color: var(--textColor); background-color: var(--backgroundColor);">PTLs can be easily split between people. </span></div>
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<div dir="auto"><span style="caret-color: rgb(39, 39, 40);">Thanks</span><br style="caret-color: rgb(39, 39, 40);" />
<br style="caret-color: rgb(39, 39, 40);" />
<span style="caret-color: rgb(39, 39, 40);">Renat Akhmerov</span><br style="caret-color: rgb(39, 39, 40);" />
<span style="caret-color: rgb(39, 39, 40);">@Nokia</span><br /></div>
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