Open Stack

 ---- On Tue, 22 Aug 2023 13:49:35 -0700  Jeremy Stanley  wrote --- 
 > On 2023-08-22 12:26:23 -0500 (-0500), Tony Breeds wrote:
 > 
 > [...]
 > 
 > > Keeping everything in sync on a fast moving target is a challenge.
 > 
 > > While none of these are insurmountable, they're also very far from
 > 
 > > trivial.  Using testing would partially address some of this but
 > 
 > > it's still a pretty big ask.
 > 
 > [...]
 > 
 > 
 > 
 > Pretty much this. It's been proven time and again (Gentoo, Suse
 > 
 > Tumbleweed, Fedora, non-LTS Ubuntu) that the constant churn in
 > 
 > packages means more time spent finding and working around
 > 
 > instability in distributions that are effectively "under
 > 
 > development" at the same time we're trying to use them to test
 > 
 > versions of OpenStack that are under development. We struggle just
 > 
 > to build images of new releases reliably, much less keep jobs
 > 
 > running on top of an ever-changing foundation of sand.
 > 
 > 
 > 
 > And before someone says "just use whatever images the distros are
 > 
 > publishing," that's what we were doing years ago. By building our
 > 
 > own images we can ensure things like consistent user IDs and
 > 
 > permissions across a diverse set of distros, insert our caches to
 > 
 > accelerate jobs, ensure minimal installed package sets have exactly
 > 
 > what's needed to bootstrap jobs without anything preinstalled that
 > 
 > may conflict with jobs, et cetera. We're already wrangling images
 > 
 > for 17 different x86 platforms and 9 different ARM platforms. If we
 > 
 > weren't able to enforce consistent entrypoints, access and content
 > 
 > on these images, we couldn't have scaled to nearly that level.

I think we have almost same model what CentOS stream follow. They are
not so stable as their development goes in parallel and that is why we test
them as our best effort.

Can we do the same for Debian experimental version? and just keep them in
our infra with the risk of unstability. That unstability  risk should be fine as
we are just running some non voting testing on those to test the next python
version.

-gmann

 > 
 > -- 
 > 
 > Jeremy Stanley
 > 
 >