<html xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
<meta name="Title" content="">
<meta name="Keywords" content="">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)">
<style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Consolas;
panose-1:2 11 6 9 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
span.apple-style-span
{mso-style-name:apple-style-span;}
span.EmailStyle18
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:Calibri;
color:windowtext;}
span.msoIns
{mso-style-type:export-only;
mso-style-name:"";
text-decoration:underline;
color:teal;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style>
</head>
<body bgcolor="white" lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Thomas,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Kolla does not use systemd fies (bifrost may be different here – I am not certain). Kolla also does not use default configuration files that are shipped with distros. We find this model
to be disruptive to reliable development. I get distros want to ship them and that’s fine by us. We just ignore them.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">What interests Kolla most is that binaries stay in the same place in the same packages. That said, if binaries are moved around, Kolla can deal with it. We adapt to our upstreams (in
Kolla’s case tarballs.openstack.org, RDO, UCA, and many others ;).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri">-steve<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in">
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-family:Calibri;color:black">From: </span>
</b><span style="font-family:Calibri;color:black">Thomas Bechtold <tbechtold@suse.com><br>
<b>Reply-To: </b>"OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org><br>
<b>Date: </b>Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 12:39 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>"OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [openstack-dev] [rpm-packaging][chef][puppet][salt][openstack-ansible][HA][tripleo][kolla][fuel] Schema proposal for config file handling for services<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 10:07:05AM -0600, Alex Schultz wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 5:03 AM, Thomas Bechtold <<a href="mailto:tbechtold@suse.com">tbechtold@suse.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> in the rpm-packaging project we started to package the services and are<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> currently discussing a possible schema for configuration files and<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> snippets used by the systemd .service files (but this would also affect<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> OCF resource agents).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> This affects packagers, endusers and config management systems (Chef,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> Puppet, Ansible, Salt, ...) so I want to discuss the proposal here on<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> the list.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">This also affects deployment tools so you may want to include tripleo,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">kolla, fuel as they are downstream consumers and may have their own<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">assumptions about how services are launched.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Done.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> Most services (at least for SUSE and RDO) are using a single config<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> (e.g. /etc/nova/nova.conf) when starting the service. Some services<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> (e.g. neutron services like neutron-l3-agent) use multiple config files.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> There are multiple problems with that approach:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - when using a config-mgmt-system, users may want to override a config<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> option (for a feature that is not yet supported) but the<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> config-mgmt-system will override the config later again.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Just to chime in here from a puppet standpoint, this is not a problem<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">because we provide a way for a user to add any extra options they wish<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">using the provider so it always ends up in the correct configuration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">file.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Does that also work if you need extra configuration files for 3rd party<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">plugins (e.g. neutron plugins) ? I guess you could just copy the 3rd<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">party config file content to the needed neutron config but that's ugly imo.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - when users adjust /etc/$service/$service.conf and a release update is<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> done (e.g. mitaka->newton) /etc/$service/$service.conf wil not be<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> overridden. That's good because the user changed something but otoh the<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> file (with all it's config options and comments) is no longer correct.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Depending on the configuration management tool, the 'default' options<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">and comments may not even be there so I'm not sure this is actually<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">that much of a concern. Also when you upgrade there is usually some<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">sort of upgrade process that has to go along with your configuration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">management tool which should take care of this for you. So i'm not<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">sure this needs to be a packaging concern.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - when config-mgmt-systems use templates for the $service.conf file,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> updating theses templates is a lot of work.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Yes which is why tools that don't use templates in the configuration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">management tool makes this a non-issue. I'm not sure this needs to be<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">a concern of packagers as it's an issue with the configuration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">management tool of choice and many of these tools have switched away<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">from templates or are currently handling this. If the configuration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">management tool doesn't support this or is suffering from this, simply<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">adding conf.d support might help but then you also run into issues<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">about ensuring things are removed and cleaned up.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">There *are* config-mgmt-tools still using templates. And having the<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">possibility to add config snippets simplifies the process here without<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">any downside for available solutions. Just don't use it if you don't<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">need it.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - setting configuration options per service (let's say cinder-volume<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> needs other config options than cinder-api) is not possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">So I agree this is more likely a real problem, but i'm not sure this<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">should be solved by packaging as this probably needs to be addressed<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">in upstream. Unless this is already a thing and it's just never been<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">properly implemented when deployed via packages. The issue I have with<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">only solving this via rpm packaging is that for tools that support<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">both rpms and debs this would lead to 2 different configuration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">mechanisms. So I would vote not to do anything different then what<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">debs also do unless both packaging methods are updated at the same<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">time.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Don't you have already a lot of different implementations for rpm<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">vs. deb, different apache config dir styles, different package name, ...<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Improving the rpm side only if the deb side also changes is not going to<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">work I think.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Do we have any examples or instances where an end user would<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">specifically want to configure two of the services in a conflicting<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">fashion? Or are there configuration options that fall into this<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">pattern? I thought the service specific items where in their own<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">configuration namespace to allow for such things. I would assume that<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">the bigger issue would be wanting to run two of the same service on<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">the same host with different configurations I would think that's where<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">something like containers would handle this case better than trying to<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">have multiple configuration files.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">In HA case you may want to set the hostname for all cinder-volumes to<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">the same name but to something different for cinder-api (if both<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">services run on the same host). I'm sure there are other examples.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> So here's the proposal to fix theses problems. The proposal is based on<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> what RDO is already doing with neutron and extends it a bit. Let's do it<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> for Nova as an example:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - /usr/share/nova/nova-dist.conf<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> This is the configuration file a distribution (openSUSE, RDO, ...) can<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> modify. It must not be modified by endusers and will be overridden with<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> package updates<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - /etc/nova/nova.conf<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> This is an empty file . Users/config-mgmt-systems can modify it and it<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> will not be overridden (if changed) with a package update.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - /etc/nova/conf.d/common/<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> In this directory, config snippets can be added. By convention,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> config-mgmt-systems would install files starting with 100-XXX.conf,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> endusers would install files starting with 500-XXX.conf . Also this<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> directory is used by all services (nova-api, nova-compute, ...).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - /etc/nova/conf.d/$service/ (e.g. /etc/nova/conf.d/nova-compute/)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> Also a dir for config snippets (with same rules as for<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> /etc/nova/conf.d/common/ ) but this dir is only used by $service (in<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> this case nova-compute)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - /usr/share/doc/packages/openstack-nova/nova.conf.sample<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> The unmodified sample config from upstream<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> - /etc/nova/README<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> Explaining the configuration structure and where to find the whole<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> sample config.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">From a packaging standpoint it's probably better to provide less and<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">not more default configuration files as the tooling usually has to go<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">an clean this stuff up as they have their own ways of configuring the<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">services. Currently they may align with the existing packaging files<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">or they may completely remove what's provided via packaging and setup<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">their own structure. Speaking from experience, having to cleanup<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">package provided configuration files is a pain[0][1].<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">There are not more config files with this proposal. It's the same<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">amount, just more possibilities. the nova-dist.conf is already in use<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">for RDO and neutron [2]. This would be just used for all services.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">/etc/$service/$service.conf is the usual thing and also read by default<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">by oslo.config . The conf.d directory delivered by a package would be<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">completly empty. So nothing to cleanup there.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">[2]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><a href="https://github.com/rdo-packages/neutron-distgit/blob/rpm-master/neutron-server.service">https://github.com/rdo-packages/neutron-distgit/blob/rpm-master/neutron-server.service</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">[0]
<a href="https://github.com/openstack/puppet-horizon/blob/master/manifests/wsgi/apache.pp#L115-L128">
https://github.com/openstack/puppet-horizon/blob/master/manifests/wsgi/apache.pp#L115-L128</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">[1]
<a href="https://github.com/openstack/puppet-tripleo/blob/master/manifests/ui.pp#L94-L107">
https://github.com/openstack/puppet-tripleo/blob/master/manifests/ui.pp#L94-L107</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> So starting nova-api would be:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> nova-api --config-file /usr/share/nova/nova-dist.conf<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> --config-file /etc/nova/nova.conf<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> --config-dir /etc/nova/conf.d/common/<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> --config-dir /etc/nova/conf.d/nova-api/<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">So from a puppet standpoint we actually go out of our way to default<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">to the python defaults and we may purge all values not explicitly set<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">via puppet. This would break our assumptions around this. I<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">personally do not agree with forcing the *-dist.conf into the loading<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">path as this may also cause issues with unwanted values being injected<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">by packagers.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">This is already happening in RDO+neutron. See [2]. So nothing new here.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">The danger for people who use puppet is that we<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">currently expected some values to not be defined in the configuration<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">files thus falling back to the python defaults. If they now get<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">defined in service-dist.conf and we undefine it in service.conf<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">(because that's what we currently configure), the end user is now<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">going to get a value they did not expect or want.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">It's not about providing a complete config (which wouldn't work anyway)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">but setting for some values sane defaults. See [3].<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">[3]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><a href="https://github.com/rdo-packages/neutron-distgit/blob/rpm-master/neutron-dist.conf">https://github.com/rdo-packages/neutron-distgit/blob/rpm-master/neutron-dist.conf</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> The order of command line switches (--config-file/--config-dir) is<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> important here. Also --config-dir is ordering the files. So adding a<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> config snippet to /etc/nova/conf.d/nova-api/ with<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> e.g. [DEFAULT]bind_port would override the option from the previous<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">> configs (last found option wins).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">This gets complicated to follow and may lead to issues on the user<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">side when ordering is a problem or attempting to debug issues. I think<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">this can lead to more issues than it's solving.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Most services print the complete config when running in debug mode. So<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">getting th used config is not complicated. Also adding theses switches<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">makes it more explicit when doing e.g. "ps awxu|grep nova-api" because<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">you see then what Also knowing which files/dirs are used is just "ps<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">awxu|grep $service".<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">And afaik oslo.config already loads implicit config files if they are<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">present.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Personally unless this structure is also followed by the deb<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">packaging, I'd prefer not to switch to this as it may lead to even<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">more fragmentation when it comes to trying to configure OpenStack<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">deployed via packages. Has this been requested by an end user to<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">solve a specific problem? What exactly is the problem that's trying<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">to be solved other than trying to allow for two of the same project's<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">services being configured in (currently) conflicting fashions?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">See my anwers above. It's not only about different configs for different<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">service.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Thanks for the feedback!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Tom<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">__________________________________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black">Unsubscribe:
<a href="mailto:OpenStack-dev-request@lists.openstack.org">OpenStack-dev-request@lists.openstack.org</a>?subject:unsubscribe<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><a href="http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev">http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Consolas;color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</body>
</html>