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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Thanks for your inputs. It sounds like we have no other option besides Barbican as long as we need to store credentials in Magnum. Then I have a new proposal:
switch to an alternative authentication mechanism that doesn’t require to store credentials in Magnum. For example, the following options are available in Kubernetes [1]:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Client certificate authentication<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Token File<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">OpenID Connect ID Token<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Basic authentication<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Keystone authentication<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Could we pick one of those?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">[1]
<a href="http://kubernetes.io/docs/admin/authentication/">http://kubernetes.io/docs/admin/authentication/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Best regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Hongbin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Dave McCowan (dmccowan) [mailto:dmccowan@cisco.com]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> March-19-16 10:56 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] High Availability<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">The most basic requirement here for Magnum is that it needs a safe place to store credentials. A safe place can not be provided by just a library or even by
just a daemon. Secure storage is provided by either hardware solution (an HSM) or a software solution (SoftHSM, DogTag, IPA, IdM). A project should give a variety of secure storage options to the user.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">On this, we have competing requirements. Devs need a turnkey option for easy testing locally or in the gate. Users kicking the tires want a realistic solution
they try out easily with DevStack. Operators who already have secure storage deployed for their cloud want an option that plugs into their existing HSMs. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Any roll-your-own option is not going to meet all of these requirements.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">A good example, that does meet all of these requirements, is the key manager implementation in Nova and Cinder. [1] [2]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Nova and Cinder work together to provide volume encryption, and like Magnum, have a need to store and share keys securely. Using a plugin architecture, and the
Barbican API, they implement a variety of key storage options:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">- Fixed key allows for insecure stand alone operation, running only Nova and Cinder<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">- Barbican with static key, allows for easy deployment that can be started within DevStack by few lines of config.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">- Barbican with a secure backend, allows for production grade secure storage of keys that has been tested on a variety of HSMs and software options.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Barbican's adoption is growing. Nova, Cinder, Neutron LBaaS, Sahara, and Magnum all have implementations using Barbican. Swift and DNSSec also have use cases.
There are both RPM and Debian packages available for Barbican. There are (at least tech preview) versions of puppet modules, Ansible playbooks, and DevStack plugins to deploy Barbican.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">In summary, I think using Barbican absorbs the complexity of doing secure storage correctly. It gives operators production grade secure storage options, while
giving devs easier options.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">--Dave McCowan<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">[1]
<a href="https://github.com/openstack/nova/tree/master/nova/keymgr">https://github.com/openstack/nova/tree/master/nova/keymgr</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">[2]
<a href="https://github.com/openstack/cinder/tree/master/cinder/keymgr">https://github.com/openstack/cinder/tree/master/cinder/keymgr</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Hongbin Lu <<a href="mailto:hongbin.lu@huawei.com">hongbin.lu@huawei.com</a>><br>
<b>Reply-To: </b>"OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <<a href="mailto:openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org">openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Friday, March 18, 2016 at 10:52 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>"OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <<a href="mailto:openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org">openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] High Availability<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">OK. If using Keystone is not acceptable, I am going to propose a new approach:</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Store data in Magnum DB</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Encrypt data before writing it to DB</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Decrypt data after loading it from DB</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Have the encryption/decryption key stored in config file</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Use encryption/decryption algorithm provided by a library</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">The approach above is the exact approach used by Heat to protect hidden parameters [1]. Compared to the Barbican option, this approach is much lighter and simpler,
and provides a basic level of data protection. This option is a good supplement to the Barbican option, which is heavy but provides advanced level of protection. It will fit into the use cases that users don’t want to install Barbican but want a basic protection.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">If you disagree, I would request you to justify why this approach works for Heat but not for Magnum. Also, I also wonder if Heat has a plan to set a hard dependency
on Barbican for just protecting the hidden parameters.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">If you don’t like code duplication between Magnum and Heat, I would suggest to move the implementation to a oslo library to make it DRY. Thoughts?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">[1]
<a href="https://specs.openstack.org/openstack/heat-specs/specs/juno/encrypt-hidden-parameters.html">
https://specs.openstack.org/openstack/heat-specs/specs/juno/encrypt-hidden-parameters.html</a></span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Best regards,</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Hongbin</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black"> David Stanek [<a href="mailto:dstanek@dstanek.com">mailto:dstanek@dstanek.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> March-18-16 4:12 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum] High Availability</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">On Fri, Mar 18, 2016 at 4:03 PM Douglas Mendizábal <<a href="mailto:douglas.mendizabal@rackspace.com">douglas.mendizabal@rackspace.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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> Regarding the Keystone solution, I'd like to hear the Keystone team's feadback on that. It definitely sounds to me like you're trying to put a square peg in a round hole.<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">I believe that using Keystone for this is a mistake. As mentioned in the blueprint, Keystone is not encrypting the data so magnum would be on the hook to do it. So that means that if security is a requirement you'd
have to duplicate more than just code. magnum would start having a larger security burden. Since we have a system designed to securely store data I think that's the best place for data that needs to be secure.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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