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<p><font size="2" face="sans-serif">Hi Suro and Jay,</font><br>
<br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">I checked discussion below, and I do believe we also need service-list(for just magnum-api and magnum-conductor), but not so emergent requirement.</font><br>
<br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">I also think service-list should not bind to k8s or swarm etc. (can use coe-service etc.)</font><br>
<br>
<br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">But I have more for below:</font><br>
<br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">1) For k8s or swarm or mesos, I think magnum can expose through the coe-service-list.</font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">But if right now, we fetched status from DB for pods/rcs status, It seems not proper to do that, as DB has old data. We need to fetch that through k8s/swarm API endpoints.</font><br>
<br>
<br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">2) It can also expose that through k8s/swarm/mesos client tools. If users like that.</font><br>
<br>
<br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">Thanks</font><br>
<br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">Best Wishes,</font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">--------------------------------------------------------------------------------</font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">Kai Qiang Wu (吴开强 Kennan）<br>
IBM China System and Technology Lab, Beijing<br>
<br>
E-mail: wkqwu@cn.ibm.com<br>
Tel: 86-10-82451647<br>
Address: Building 28(Ring Building), ZhongGuanCun Software Park, <br>
No.8 Dong Bei Wang West Road, Haidian District Beijing P.R.China 100193</font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">--------------------------------------------------------------------------------</font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">Follow your heart. You are miracle! </font><br>
<br>
<img width="16" height="16" src="cid:1__=C7BBF404DF9195C38f9e8a93df938@cn.ibm.com" border="0" alt="Inactive hide details for Jay Lau ---08/04/2015 05:51:33 AM---Hi Suro, Yes, I did not see a strong reason for adding "service-l"><font size="2" color="#424282" face="sans-serif">Jay Lau ---08/04/2015 05:51:33 AM---Hi Suro, Yes, I did not see a strong reason for adding "service-list" to show all of</font><br>
<br>
<font size="1" color="#5F5F5F" face="sans-serif">From: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif">Jay Lau <jay.lau.513@gmail.com></font><br>
<font size="1" color="#5F5F5F" face="sans-serif">To: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif">"OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org></font><br>
<font size="1" color="#5F5F5F" face="sans-serif">Date: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif">08/04/2015 05:51 AM</font><br>
<font size="1" color="#5F5F5F" face="sans-serif">Subject: </font><font size="1" face="sans-serif">Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][blueprint] magnum-service-list</font><br>
<hr width="100%" size="2" align="left" noshade style="color:#8091A5; "><br>
<br>
<br>
<font size="3" face="serif">Hi Suro,<br>
</font><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">Yes, I did not see a strong reason for adding "service-list" to show all of magnum system services, but it is nice to have.<br>
</font><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">But I did see a strong reason to rename "service-list" to "coe-service-list" or others which might be more meaningful as I was often asked by someone why does "magnum service-list" is showing some services in kubernetes but not magnum system itself? This command always make people confused.<br>
</font><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">Thanks!</font><br>
<br>
<font size="3" face="serif">2015-08-03 15:36 GMT-04:00 SURO <</font><a href="mailto:suro.patz@gmail.com" target="_blank"><font size="3" color="#0000FF" face="serif"><u>suro.patz@gmail.com</u></font></a><font size="3" face="serif">>:</font>
<ul style="padding-left: 9pt"><font size="3" face="serif">Hi Jay, <br>
<br>
Thanks for clarifying the requirements further.<br>
<br>
I do agree with the idea of having 'magnum service-list' and 'magnum coe-service-list' to distinguish that coe-service is a different concept. BUT, in openstack space, I do not see 'service-list' as a standardized function across other APIs -</font>
<ul style="padding-left: 18pt"><font size="2" face="sans-serif">1. </font><font size="3" face="serif"> 'nova service-list' => Enlists services like api, conductor etc. </font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">2. </font><font size="3" face="serif"> neutron does not have this option.</font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">3. </font><font size="3" face="serif"> 'heat service-list' => Enlists available engines.</font><br>
<font size="2" face="sans-serif">4. </font><font size="3" face="serif"> 'keystone service-list' => Enlists services/APIs who consults keystone.</font></ul>
<font size="3" face="serif">Now in magnum, we may choose to model it after nova, but nova really has a bunch of backend services, viz. nova-conductor, nova-cert, nova-scheduler, nova-consoleauth, nova-compute[x N], whereas magnum not.<br>
<br>
For magnum, at this point creating 'service-list' only for api/conductor - do you see a strong need?<br>
</font><br>
<tt><font size="3">Regards,<br>
SURO<br>
irc//freenode: suro-patz<br>
</font></tt><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">On 8/3/15 12:00 PM, Jay Lau wrote:</font>
<ul style="padding-left: 36pt"><font size="3" face="serif">Hi Suro and others, comments on this? Thanks.</font><br>
<br>
<font size="3" face="serif">2015-07-30 5:40 GMT-04:00 Jay Lau <</font><a href="mailto:jay.lau.513@gmail.com" target="_blank"><font size="3" color="#0000FF" face="serif"><u>jay.lau.513@gmail.com</u></font></a><font size="3" face="serif">>:</font>
<ul style="padding-left: 9pt"><font size="3" face="serif">Hi Suro,<br>
</font><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">In my understanding, even other CoE might have service/pod/rc concepts in future, we may still want to distinguish the "magnum service-list" with "magnum coe-service-list".<br>
</font><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">service-list is mainly for magnum native services, such as magnum-api, magnum-conductor etc.</font><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">coe-service-list mainly for the services that running for the CoEs in magnum.<br>
</font><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">Thoughts? Thanks.</font><br>
<br>
<font size="3" face="serif">2015-07-29 17:50 GMT-04:00 SURO <</font><a href="mailto:suro.patz@gmail.com" target="_blank"><font size="3" color="#0000FF" face="serif"><u>suro.patz@gmail.com</u></font></a><font size="3" face="serif">>:</font>
<ul style="padding-left: 9pt"><font size="3" face="serif">Hi Hongbin,<br>
<br>
What would be the value of having COE-specific magnum command to go and talk to DB? As in that case, user may use the native client itself to fetch the data from COE, which even will have latest state.<br>
<br>
In a pluggable architecture there is always scope for common abstraction and driver implementation. I think it is too early to declare service/rc/pod as specific to k8s, as the other COEs may very well converge onto similar/same concepts.<br>
</font><br>
<tt><font size="3">Regards,<br>
SURO<br>
irc//freenode: suro-patz<br>
</font></tt><br>
<font size="3" face="serif">On 7/29/15 2:21 PM, Hongbin Lu wrote:</font>
<ul style="padding-left: 36pt"><br>
<font size="2" color="#1F497D" face="Calibri">Suro,</font>
<p><font size="2" color="#1F497D" face="Calibri"> </font>
<p><font size="2" color="#1F497D" face="Calibri">I think service/pod/rc are k8s-specific. +1 for Jay’s suggestion about renaming COE-specific command, since the new naming style looks consistent with other OpenStack projects. In addition, it will eliminate name collision of different COEs. Also, if we are going to support pluggable COE, adding prefix to COE-specific command is unavoidable.</font>
<p><font size="2" color="#1F497D" face="Calibri"> </font>
<p><font size="2" color="#1F497D" face="Calibri">Best regards,</font>
<p><font size="2" color="#1F497D" face="Calibri">Hongbin</font>
<p><font size="2" color="#1F497D" face="Calibri"> </font>
<p><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><b>From:</b></font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"> SURO [</font><a href="mailto:suro.patz@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:suro.patz@gmail.com" target="_blank"><font size="2" color="#0000FF" face="Tahoma"><u>mailto:suro.patz@gmail.com</u></font></a><font size="2" face="Tahoma">] </font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><b><br>
Sent:</b></font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"> July-29-15 4:03 PM</font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><b><br>
To:</b></font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"> Jay Lau</font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><b><br>
Cc:</b></font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"> </font><a href="mailto:suro@yahoo-inc.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:suro@yahoo-inc.com" target="_blank"><font size="2" color="#0000FF" face="Tahoma"><u>suro@yahoo-inc.com</u></font></a><font size="2" face="Tahoma">; OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)</font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"><b><br>
Subject:</b></font><font size="2" face="Tahoma"> Re: [openstack-dev] [magnum][blueprint] magnum-service-list</font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif"> </font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">Hi Jay,<br>
<br>
'service'/'pod'/'rc' are conceptual abstraction at magnum level. Yes, the abstraction was inspired from the same in kubernetes, but the data stored in DB about a 'service' is properly abstracted and not k8s-specific at the top level. <br>
<br>
If we plan to change this to 'k8s-service-list', the same applies for even creation and other actions. This will give rise to COE-specific command and concepts and which may proliferate further. Instead, we can abstract swarm's service concept under the umbrella of magnum's 'service' concept without creating k8s-service and swarm-service.<br>
<br>
I suggest we should keep the concept/abstraction at Magnum level, as it is. <br>
</font>
<p><tt><font size="3">Regards,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">SURO</font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">irc//freenode: suro-patz</font></tt>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">On 7/28/15 7:59 PM, Jay Lau wrote:</font>
<ul style="padding-left: 36pt"><font size="3" face="serif">Hi Suro,</font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">Sorry for late. IMHO, even the "magnum service-list" is getting data from DB, but the DB is actually persisting some data for Kubernetes service, so my thinking is it possible to change "magnum service-list" to "magnum k8s-service-list", same for pod and rc.</font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">I know this might bring some trouble for backward compatibility issue, not sure if it is good to do such modification at this time. Comments?</font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">Thanks</font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif"> </font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">2015-07-27 20:12 GMT-04:00 SURO <</font><a href="mailto:suro.patz@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:suro.patz@gmail.com" target="_blank"><font size="3" color="#0000FF" face="serif"><u>suro.patz@gmail.com</u></font></a><font size="3" face="serif">>:</font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">Hi all,<br>
As we did not hear back further on the requirement of this blueprint, I propose to keep the existing behavior without any modification.<br>
<br>
We would like to explore the decision on this blueprint on our next weekly IRC meeting[1].<br>
</font>
<p><tt><font size="3">Regards,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">SURO</font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">irc//freenode: suro-patz</font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3"> </font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">[1] - </font></tt><a href="https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Containers" target="_blank"><tt><font size="3" color="#0000FF"><u>https://wiki.openstack.org/wiki/Meetings/Containers</u></font></tt></a>
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<tr valign="top"><td width="110" valign="middle"><font size="3" face="serif">2015-07-28 </font></td><td width="170" valign="middle"><font size="3" face="serif">UTC 2200 Tuesday </font></td></tr>
</table>
<tt><font size="3"> </font></tt>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">On 7/21/15 4:54 PM, SURO wrote: </font>
<ul style="padding-left: 36pt"><font size="3" face="serif">Hi all, [special attention: Jay Lau] The bp[1] registered, asks for the following implementation - </font>
<ul type="disc" style="padding-left: 36pt">
<li><font size="3" face="serif">'magnum service-list' should be similar to 'nova service-list'</font>
<li><font size="3" face="serif">'magnum service-list' should be moved to be ' magnum k8s-service-list'. Also similar holds true for 'pod-list'/'rc-list'</font></ul>
<br>
<font size="3" face="serif">As I dug some details, I find - </font>
<ul type="disc" style="padding-left: 36pt">
<li><font size="3" face="serif">'magnum service-list' fetches data from OpenStack DB[2], instead of the COE endpoint. So technically it is not k8s-specific. magnum is serving data for objects modeled as 'service', just the way we are catering for 'magnum container-list' in case of swarm bay.</font>
<li><font size="3" face="serif">If magnum provides a way to get the COE endpoint details, users can use native tools to fetch the status of the COE-specific objects, viz. 'kubectl get services' here.</font>
<li><font size="3" face="serif">nova has lot more backend services, e.g. cert, scheduler, consoleauth, compute etc. in comparison to magnum's conductor only. Also, not all the api's have this 'service-list' available. </font></ul>
<br>
<font size="3" face="serif">With these arguments in view, can we have some more explanation/clarification in favor of the ask in the blueprint? [1] - </font><a href="https://blueprints.launchpad.net/magnum/+spec/magnum-service-list" target="_blank"></a><a href="https://blueprints.launchpad.net/magnum/+spec/magnum-service-list" target="_blank"><font size="3" color="#0000FF" face="serif"><u>https://blueprints.launchpad.net/magnum/+spec/magnum-service-list</u></font></a><font size="3" face="serif"> [2] - </font><a href="https://github.com/openstack/magnum/blob/master/magnum/objects/service.py#L114" target="_blank"></a><a href="https://github.com/openstack/magnum/blob/master/magnum/objects/service.py#L114" target="_blank"><font size="3" color="#0000FF" face="serif"><u>https://github.com/openstack/magnum/blob/master/magnum/objects/service.py#L114</u></font></a><font size="3" face="serif"> </font>
<p><tt><font size="3">-- </font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">Regards,</font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">SURO</font></tt><br>
<tt><font size="3">irc//freenode: suro-patz</font></tt></ul>
<br>
<font size="3" face="serif"><br>
<br>
<br>
-- </font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">Thanks,</font>
<p><font size="3" face="serif">Jay Lau (Guangya Liu)</font></ul>
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<font size="3" face="serif">Thanks,<br>
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<font size="3" face="serif">Thanks,<br>
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