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Hi Nikolay,<br>
<br>
I am not sure about that. I mentioned it because bellow described
usecase could be argument to continue work on that.<br>
<br>
Filip<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 07/07/2015 05:29 PM, Nikolay
Starodubtsev wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAAa8YgBXOs6xD5UBAXqw4gn3kQ0nXmvAdBdu7sK_8su3f2NTKA@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=windows-1252">
<div dir="ltr">Filip,<br>
Are you sure that this bp is still alive? Looks like the spec
was freezed a month ago and development wasn't started.</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div class="gmail_signature">
<div dir="ltr"><font color="#888888">
<div dir="ltr">
<div
style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:13px;font-family:arial,sans-serif">
<p
style="font-size:small;margin:0px;font-family:Helvetica">
</p>
<p
style="font-size:small;margin:0px;font-family:Helvetica"><b><u>
</u></b></p>
<p
style="font-size:small;margin:0px;font-family:Helvetica">Nikolay
Starodubtsev<br>
</p>
<p
style="font-size:small;margin:0px;font-family:Helvetica">Software
Engineer</p>
<p
style="font-size:small;margin:0px;font-family:Helvetica">
Mirantis Inc.<br>
</p>
<p
style="font-size:small;margin:0px;font-family:Helvetica"><br>
</p>
<p
style="font-size:small;margin:0px;font-family:Helvetica">Skype:
dark_harlequi<font color="#888888">ne1</font><br>
</p>
</div>
</div>
</font></div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">2015-07-07 17:47 GMT+03:00 vemana
Kanaka Durgarao <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:vkdrtechsavvy@gmail.com" target="_blank">vkdrtechsavvy@gmail.com</a>></span>:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<p dir="ltr"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:vemana.kanakadurgarao@gmail.com"
target="_blank">vemana.kanakadurgarao@gmail.com</a></p>
<div class="HOEnZb">
<div class="h5">
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr">On Tue, 7 Jul 2015 10:24 Filip Blaha
<<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:filip.blaha@hp.com" target="_blank">filip.blaha@hp.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Hi all,<br>
<br>
there is related blueprint [1]. Once it will be
implemented it could support this usecase. So
policy defined in congress modifies environment
prior deployment. I think this mechanism could be
used to enforce placement to region/AZ.<br>
<br>
[1]
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://blueprints.launchpad.net/murano/+spec/policy-based-env-modification"
target="_blank">https://blueprints.launchpad.net/murano/+spec/policy-based-env-modification</a><br>
<br>
Regards</div>
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><br>
Filip</div>
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"><br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 07/06/2015 08:40 PM, Georgy Okrokvertskhov
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Hi Tim,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thank you for the comprehensive
information.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>From Murano standpoint each OpenStack
region is a separate Heat endpoint. So once
Murano has a decision about placement it
will just use proper Heat endpoint to
initiate stack creation process.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Murano does not expect that Congress will
do actual placement. Murano has a way to do
this by itself as it just pushes stack
template to the Heat.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As I see in your reply there is a clear
way to define such policies which is really
great. It sounds like there is nothing we
need to change in the Congress itself which
is also great.</div>
<div>I think we have explicit Congress call in
Murano, at least it was discussed in Paris.
I will check if we have someone in Murano
team who can draft a spec for this feature
and use case in Murano. Sounds like we have
enough information for that.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Once again, thank you for the
information. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,</div>
<div>Gosha </div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Jul 6, 2015
at 9:13 AM, Tim Hinrichs <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:tim@styra.com"
target="_blank">tim@styra.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr"><br>
<span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">Sorry--hit
the Send button by accident.</span><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr"><span><br>
Hi Gosha,<br>
<br>
This definitely sounds like an
interesting use case for
Congress. Keep in mind that
Congress doesn't itself do
placement (though we did some
experimentation with that
[1][2]). Some thoughts.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>1. Let's suppose
Murano/Congress/etc. allow us
to figure out which app should
be deployed in which region.
Is there a separate Nova for
each region that can do the
actual scheduling? If not,
how would Murano force the app
to be deployed in the proper
region?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</span>
<div>2. Let's assume Murano can
force the app to the proper
region. One option for using
Congress to compute the proper
region would be to write policy
statements that enumerate the
permitted regions for a given
application, and then ask
Congress for one of those
regions. For your suggested
policies above, we could write
the following datalog statements</div>
</div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px"></span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex"><span>
<div dir="ltr">
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">"Solaris
is required then select
Region_Solaris. "</span><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</span>
<div dir="ltr">
<div>permitted_region(app,
"region_solaris") :- </div>
<div> murano:app_requires(app,
"solaris")</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>A. If Solaris is required then
select region_solaris</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>permitted_region(app,
"region_solaris") :-</div>
<div> murano:app_requires(app,
"solaris") </div>
<div> </div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">B.
If Solaris is required then select
less loaded regions from
[Region_Solaris1, Region_Solaris2]</span><br>
</div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">This
one requires additional
expressiveness in the language
than we currently have (because it
asks to minimize over several
options). But it would be
something like...</span></div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">best_region(app,
min(y)) :-</span></div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">
permitted_region(app, x),</span></div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">
ceilometer:region_load(x, y) </span></div>
<span>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span
style="font-size:13.1999998092651px;line-height:19.7999992370605px">
</span></div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>[1] Design doc: <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ksDilJYXV-5AXWON8PLMedDKr9NpS8VbT0jIy_MIEtI/edit"
target="_blank">https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ksDilJYXV-5AXWON8PLMedDKr9NpS8VbT0jIy_MIEtI/edit</a><br>
<div>[2] Slides: <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://drive.google.com/a/styra.com/file/d/0ByDz-eYOtswScUFUc1ZrVVhmQlk/view"
target="_blank">https://drive.google.com/a/styra.com/file/d/0ByDz-eYOtswScUFUc1ZrVVhmQlk/view</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
</span><span><font color="#888888">
<div>Tim</div>
</font></span>
<div>
<div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr">On Thu, Jul 2,
2015 at 7:36 AM Georgy
Okrokvertskhov <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:gokrokvertskhov@mirantis.com"
target="_blank">gokrokvertskhov@mirantis.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">Hi,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>All applications are
monolithic so they don't
need to be split over
multiple regions. It is
necessary to have an
ability to select a
region based on
requirements and for now
I don't care how they
are placed inside the
region. </div>
<div>I am not sure how
region's capabilities
will be stored and
actually this is a
reason why I am asking
if Congress will solve
this. I can imagine a
policy which says if
Solaris is required then
select Region_Solaris.
Or more complex If
Solaris is required then
select less loaded
regions from
[Region_Solaris1,
Region_Solaris2]</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>In this use case
Murano will deploy
complex environment
which consist of
multiple atomic
applications with
different requirements,
so deployment will be
across clouds but for
whole environment.
Imagine IBM MQ on AIX
and PowerPC + Oracle DB
on Solaris + Microsoft
IIS on Windows 2012
& HyperV + WebSphere
on RHEL & KVM.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thanks</div>
<div>Gosha</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On
Wed, Jul 1, 2015 at
10:17 PM, <span
dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:ruby.krishnaswamy@orange.com" target="_blank">ruby.krishnaswamy@orange.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote
class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px
#ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div link="blue"
vlink="purple"
lang="FR">
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Hi</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US">Did
you mean
placement at
“two levels”.
First to
select the
region and
then within
each region,
Nova scheduler
will place on
hosts.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US">But
where will the
capabilities
of each region
(based on
which
placement
decision will
be made) be
stored? Will
each region be
queried to
obtain this
information?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US">Will
a single
application
need to be
placed (split
across)
different
regions?</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US"></span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US">Ruby</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"
lang="EN-US"> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">De :</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
Georgy
Okrokvertskhov
[mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:gokrokvertskhov@mirantis.com" target="_blank">gokrokvertskhov@mirantis.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Envoyé :</b>
mercredi 1
juillet 2015
21:26<br>
<b>À :</b>
OpenStack
Development
Mailing List<br>
<b>Objet :</b>
[openstack-dev]
[Murano][Congress]
Application
placement use
case</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div><span>
<p
style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Hi,</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p
style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I
would like to
share with the
community one
of the real
use case which
we saw while
working with
one of the
Murano
customer and
ask an advice.
This customer
has multiple
OpenStack
regions which
are serving
for different
hypervisors.
The reason for
that is Oracle
OpenStack
which is used
to work with
Solaris on top
of SPARC
architecture.
There are
other
hypervisors
KVM and VMWare
which are
used.</span></p>
<p
style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">There
are multiple
applications
which should
be placed to
different
regions based
on their
requirements
(OS,
Hypervisor,
networking
restrictions).
As there is no
single cloud,
Nova scheduler
can’t be used
(at least in
my
understanding)
so we need to
have some
placement
policies to
put
applications
properly. And
obviously we
don’t want to
ask end user
about the
placement.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p
style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Right
now in Murano
we can do this
by:</span></p>
</span>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:36.0pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><span>1.<span>
</span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Hardcoding
placement
inside
application.
This approach
will work and
does not
require any
significant
change in
Murano. But
there are
obvious
limitations
like if we
have two
options for
placement
which one
should be
hardcoded. </span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:36.0pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><span>2.<span>
</span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Create
special
placement
scheduler
application\class
in Murano
which will use
some logic to
place
applications
properly. This
is better
approach as
nothing is
hard coded in
applications
except their
requirements.
Applications
will just have
a workflow to
ask placement
scheduler for
a decision and
then will just
use this
decision.</span></p>
<p
style="margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:0cm;margin-left:36.0pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;vertical-align:baseline"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"><span>3.<span>
</span></span></span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Use
some external
tool or
OpenStack
component for
placement
decision. This
is a very
generic use
case which we
saw multiple
times. Tools
like CIRBA are
often used for
this. Murano
will need an
interface to
ask these
tools. I think
about this
solution as an
extension of
2.</span></p>
<span>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p
style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">I
am aware that
Murano is
working on
integration
with Congress
and I am
looking for an
opportunity
here to
address real
use case of
Murano usage
in real
customer
environment.
It will be
great to know
if OpenStack
can offer
something here
without
involving 3rd
party tools. I
suspect that
this is a good
use case for
Congress, but
I would like
to see how it
might be
implemented. </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p
style="margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Thanks</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Gosha</span><br
clear="all">
</p>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">--
</p>
<div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span
style="color:#999999;background:white">Georgy Okrokvertskhov<br>
Architect,<br>
</span><span
style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#999999;background:white">OpenStack
Platform
Products,</span><span
style="color:#999999;background:white"><br>
Mirantis</span><span
style="color:#999999"><br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.mirantis.com/" target="_blank">http://www.mirantis.com</a><br>
Tel. <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%2B1%20650%20963%209828" value="+16509639828" target="_blank">+1
650 963 9828</a><br>
Mob. <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%2B1%20650%20996%203284" value="+16509963284" target="_blank">+1
650 996 3284</a></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</span></div>
</div>
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-- <br>
<div>
<div dir="ltr"><font
color="#999999"><span
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">Georgy Okrokvertskhov<br>
Architect,<br>
<span
style="font-family:arial;font-size:small">OpenStack
Platform
Products,</span><br>
Mirantis</span><br>
<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.mirantis.com/" target="_blank">http://www.mirantis.com</a><br>
Tel. <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="tel:%2B1%20650%20963%209828" value="+16509639828" target="_blank">+1
650 963 9828</a><br>
Mob. <a
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href="tel:%2B1%20650%20996%203284" value="+16509963284" target="_blank">+1
650 996 3284</a></font><br>
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-- <br>
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<div dir="ltr"><font color="#999999"><span
style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">Georgy
Okrokvertskhov<br>
Architect,<br>
<span
style="font-family:arial;font-size:small">OpenStack
Platform Products,</span><br>
Mirantis</span><br>
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target="_blank">http://www.mirantis.com</a><br>
Tel. +1 650 963 9828<br>
Mob. +1 650 996 3284</font><br>
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