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<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">May 5, 2015 at
9:53 AM</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color: rgb(136, 136, 136); margin-left: 24px;
margin-right: 24px;" __pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><pre wrap="">On Tue, 2015-05-05 at 10:45 +0200, Thierry Carrez wrote:
</pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">Joe Gordon wrote:
</pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">[...]
To tackle this I would like to propose the idea of a periodic developer
oriented newsletter, and if we agree to go forward with this, hopefully
the foundation can help us find someone to write newsletter.
</pre></blockquote><pre wrap="">I've been discussing the idea of a "LWN" for OpenStack for some time,
originally with Mark McLoughlin. For those who don't know it, LWN
(lwn.net) is a source of quality tech reporting on Linux in general (and
the kernel in particular). It's written by developers and tech reporters
and funded by subscribers.
An LWN-like OpenStack development newsletter would provide general
status, dive into specific features, report on specific
talks/conferences, summarize threads etc. It would be tremendously
useful to the development community.
The issue is, who can write such content ? It is a full-time job to
produce authored content, you can't just copy (or link to) content
produced elsewhere. It takes a very special kind of individual to write
such content: the person has to be highly technical, able to tackle any
topic, and totally connected with the OpenStack development community.
That person has to be cross-project and ideally have already-built
legitimacy.
</pre></blockquote><pre wrap=""><!---->
Here, you're being overly restrictive. Lwn.net isn't staffed by top
level kernel maintainers (although it does solicit the occasional
article from them). It's staffed by people who gained credibility via
their insightful reporting rather than by their contributions. I see no
reason why the same model wouldn't work for OpenStack.
There is one technical difference: in the kernel, you can get all the
information from the linux-kernel (and other mailing list) firehose if
you're skilled enough to extract it. With OpenStack, openstack-dev
isn't enough so you have to do other stuff as well, but that's more or
less equivalent to additional research.
</pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap=""> It's basically the kind of profile every OpenStack company
is struggling and fighting to hire. And that rare person should not
really want to spend that much time developing (or become CTO of a
startup) but prefer to write technical articles about what happens in
OpenStack development. I'm not sure such a person exists. And a
newsletter actually takes more than one such person, because it's a lot
of work (even if not weekly).
</pre></blockquote><pre wrap=""><!---->
That's a bit pessimistic: followed to it's logical conclusion it would
say that lwn.net can't exist either ... which is a bit of a
contradiction.
</pre><blockquote type="cite"><pre wrap="">So as much as I'd like this to happen, I'm not convinced it's worth
getting excited unless we have clear indication that we would have
people willing and able to pull it off. The matter of who pays the bill
is secondary -- I just don't think the profile exists.
For the matter, I tried to push such an idea in the past and couldn't
find anyone to fit the rare profile I think is needed to succeed. All
the people I could think of had other more interesting things to do. I
don't think things changed -- but I'd love to be proven wrong.
</pre></blockquote><pre wrap=""><!---->
Um, I assume you've thought of this already, but have you tried asking
lwn.net? As you say above, they already fit the profile. Whether they
have the bandwidth is another matter, but I believe their Chief Editor
(Jon Corbet) may welcome a broadening of the funding base, particularly
if the OpenStack foundation were offering seed funding for the
endeavour.
</pre></div>
</blockquote>
<br>
+1 to that, although lwn.net is partially subscriber only (yes I'm a
subscriber); so if say we had a 'openstack section' there (just like
there is a kernel section, or a security section, or a distributions
section...) how would that work? It'd be neat to have what we do on
lwn.net vs having a openstack clone/similar thing to lwn.net (because
IMHO we already make ourselves 'special' enough...).<br>
<br>
-Josh<br>
<br>
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<pre wrap="">
James
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<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">May 5, 2015 at
1:45 AM</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div><!----><br>I've been
discussing the idea of a "LWN" for OpenStack for some time,<br>originally
with Mark McLoughlin. For those who don't know it, LWN<br>(lwn.net) is a
source of quality tech reporting on Linux in general (and<br>the kernel
in particular). It's written by developers and tech reporters<br>and
funded by subscribers.<br><br>An LWN-like OpenStack development
newsletter would provide general<br>status, dive into specific features,
report on specific<br>talks/conferences, summarize threads etc. It
would be tremendously<br>useful to the development community.<br><br>The
issue is, who can write such content ? It is a full-time job to<br>produce
authored content, you can't just copy (or link to) content<br>produced
elsewhere. It takes a very special kind of individual to write<br>such
content: the person has to be highly technical, able to tackle any<br>topic,
and totally connected with the OpenStack development community.<br>That
person has to be cross-project and ideally have already-built<br>legitimacy.
It's basically the kind of profile every OpenStack company<br>is
struggling and fighting to hire. And that rare person should not<br>really
want to spend that much time developing (or become CTO of a<br>startup)
but prefer to write technical articles about what happens in<br>OpenStack
development. I'm not sure such a person exists. And a<br>newsletter
actually takes more than one such person, because it's a lot<br>of work
(even if not weekly).<br><br>So as much as I'd like this to happen, I'm
not convinced it's worth<br>getting excited unless we have clear
indication that we would have<br>people willing and able to pull it off.
The matter of who pays the bill<br>is secondary -- I just don't think
the profile exists.<br><br>For the matter, I tried to push such an idea
in the past and couldn't<br>find anyone to fit the rare profile I think
is needed to succeed. All<br>the people I could think of had other more
interesting things to do. I<br>don't think things changed -- but I'd
love to be proven wrong.<br><br></div></div>
<div style="margin:30px 25px 10px 25px;" class="__pbConvHr"><div
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#EDEEF0;padding-top:5px"> <div
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photoaddress="joe.gordon0@gmail.com" photoname="Joe Gordon"
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<font color="#9FA2A5"><span style="padding-left:6px">May 4, 2015 at
12:03 PM</span></font></div></div></div>
<div style="color:#888888;margin-left:24px;margin-right:24px;"
__pbrmquotes="true" class="__pbConvBody"><div dir="ltr"><div>Before
going any further, I am proposing something to make it easier for the
developer community to keep track of what other projects are working on.
I am not proposing anything to directly help operators or users, that
is a separate problem space.<br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>In
Mark McClain's TC candidacy email he brought up the issue of cross
project communication[0]:</div><div><br></div><div>Better cross project
communication will make it easier to share technical solutions and
promote a more unified experience across projects. It seems like just
about every time I talk to people from different projects I learn about
something interesting and relevant that they are working on. </div><div><br></div><div>While
I usually track discussions on the mailing list, it is a poor way of
keeping track of what the big issues each project is working on.
Stefano's 'OpenStack Community Weekly Newsletter' does a good job of
highlighting many things including important mailing list conversations,
but it doesn't really answer the question of What is X (Ironic, Nova,
Neutron, Cinder, Keystone, Heat etc.) up to?</div><div><br></div><div>To
tackle this I would like to propose the idea of a periodic developer
oriented newsletter, and if we agree to go forward with this, hopefully
the foundation can help us find someone to write newsletter.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Now
on to the details.</div><div><br></div><div>I am not sure what the
right cadence for this newsletter would be, but I think weekly is too </div><div>frequent
and once a 6 month cycle would be too infrequent.</div><div><br></div><div>The
big questions I would like to see answered are:</div><div><br></div><div>*
What are the big challenges each project is currently working on?</div><div>*
What can we learn from each other?</div><div>* Where are individual
projects trying to solve the same problem independently?<br></div><div><br></div><div>To
answer these questions one needs to look at a lot of sources,
including:</div><div><br></div><div>* Weekly meeting logs, or hopefully
just the notes assuming we get better at taking detailed notes</div><div>*
approved specs</div><div>* periodically talk to the PTL of each project
to see if any big discussions were discussed else where</div><div>*
Topics selected for discussion at summits</div><div><br></div><div>Off
the top of my head here are a few topics that would make good candidates
for this newsletter:</div><div><br></div><div>* What are different
projects doing with microversioned APIs, I know that at least two
projects are tackling this</div><div>* How has the specs process evolved
in each project, we all started out from a common point but seem to
have all gone in slightly different directions</div><div>* What will
each projects priorities be in Liberty? Do any of them overlap?</div><div>*
Any process changes that projects have tried that worked or didn't work</div><div>*
How is functional testing evolving in each project</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Would
this help with cross project communication? Is this feasible? Other
thoughts?</div><div><br></div><div>best,</div><div>Joe</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>[0]
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