<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Aug 7, 2014 at 9:28 AM, Eric Harney <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:eharney@redhat.com" target="_blank">eharney@redhat.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class="">On 08/07/2014 09:55 AM, John Griffith wrote:<br>
> Seems everybody that's been around a while has noticed "issues" this<br>
> release and have talked about it, thanks Thierry for putting it together so<br>
> well and kicking off the ML thread here.<br>
><br>
> I'd agree with everything that you stated, I've also floated the idea this<br>
> past week with a few members of the Core Cinder team to have an "every<br>
> other" release for new drivers submissions in Cinder (I'm expecting this to<br>
> be a HUGELY popular proposal [note sarcastic tone]).<br>
><br>
> There are three things that have just crushed productivity and motivation<br>
> in Cinder this release (IMO):<br>
> 1. Overwhelming number of drivers (tactical contributions)<br>
> 2. Overwhelming amount of churn, literally hundreds of little changes to<br>
> modify docstrings, comments etc but no real improvements to code<br>
<br>
</div>I'm not sure that there is much data to support that this has been a<br>
problem to the point of impacting productivity. Even if some patches<br>
make changes that aren't too significant, those tend to be quick to<br>
review. Personally, I haven't found this to be a troublesome area, and<br>
it's been clear that Cinder does need some cleanup/refactoring work in<br>
some areas.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace">Ok... </div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace">s/<span style="font-family:arial">There are three things that have just crushed productivity and motivation/</span><span style="font-family:arial">There are three things that have just crushed MY productivity and motivation/g</span></div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"><span style="font-family:arial"><br></span></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"><span style="font-family:arial">better?</span></div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"><span style="font-family:arial"><br></span></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
Just going on my gut feeling, I'd argue that we too often have patchsets<br>
that are too large and should be split into a series of smaller commits,<br>
and that concerns me more, because these are both harder to review and<br>
harder to catch bugs in.<br></blockquote><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace">I totally agree with you on this, no argument at all. The never ending stream of six additions, typo fixes and new hacking adds however is a different category for me.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div class=""><br>
> 3. A new sense of pride in hitting the -1 button on reviews. A large<br>
> number of reviews these days seem to be -1 due to punctuation or<br>
> misspelling in comments and docstrings. There's also a lot of "my way of<br>
> writing this method is better because it's *clever*" taking place.<br>
<br>
</div>I still don't really have a good sense of how much this happens and what<br>
the impact is. But, the basic problem with this argument is that if we<br>
feel that #2 and #3 are both problems, we are effectively inviting the<br>
code/documentation to get sloppier and rot over time. It needs to<br>
either be cleaned up in review or patched later.<br></blockquote><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace">See my search/replace above, guess it's just me. I see it quite often, I could try and gather some numbers but honestly it seems like almost every other patch I review has a -1 for something along these lines.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
(Or if there's a dispute about "need" there, we at least need to be ok<br>
with letting people who feel that this is worthwhile fix it up.)<br>
<br>
I'd add:<br>
4. Quite a few people have put time into working on third-party driver<br>
CI, presumably at the expense of the other usual efforts. This is fine,<br>
and a good thing, but it surely impacted the amount of attention given<br>
to other efforts with our small team.<br></blockquote><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace">I do think this has certainly had a significant impact on some folks for sure. But I've already ranted about that and won't do it again here :)</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div class="im"><br>
> In Cinder's case I don't think new features is a problem, in fact we can't<br>
> seem to get new features worked on and released because of all the other<br>
> distractions. That being said doing a maintenance or hardening only type<br>
> of release is for sure good with me.<br>
><br>
> Anyway, I've had some plans to talk about how we might fix some of this in<br>
> Cinder at next week's sprint. If there's a broader community effort along<br>
> these lines that's even better.<br>
><br>
> Thanks,<br>
> John<br>
<br>
<br>
</div><div class=""><div class="h5">_______________________________________________<br>
OpenStack-dev mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org">OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev" target="_blank">http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev</a><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div>