<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 14 (filtered medium)">
<style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:Wingdings;
panose-1:5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0;}
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:Tahoma;
panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:blue;
text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:purple;
text-decoration:underline;}
p.MsoAcetate, li.MsoAcetate, div.MsoAcetate
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Balloon Text Char";
margin:0in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:8.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";}
p.MsoListParagraph, li.MsoListParagraph, div.MsoListParagraph
{mso-style-priority:34;
margin-top:0in;
margin-right:0in;
margin-bottom:0in;
margin-left:.5in;
margin-bottom:.0001pt;
font-size:12.0pt;
font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";}
span.hoenzb
{mso-style-name:hoenzb;}
span.EmailStyle19
{mso-style-type:personal;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
span.EmailStyle20
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D;}
span.BalloonTextChar
{mso-style-name:"Balloon Text Char";
mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Balloon Text";
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
/* List Definitions */
@list l0
{mso-list-id:649553059;
mso-list-template-ids:916071476;}
@list l0:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l0:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l1
{mso-list-id:654190859;
mso-list-type:hybrid;
mso-list-template-ids:1880679114 67698703 67698713 67698715 67698703 67698713 67698715 67698703 67698713 67698715;}
@list l1:level1
{mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l1:level2
{mso-level-number-format:alpha-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l1:level3
{mso-level-number-format:roman-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:right;
text-indent:-9.0pt;}
@list l1:level4
{mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l1:level5
{mso-level-number-format:alpha-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l1:level6
{mso-level-number-format:roman-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:right;
text-indent:-9.0pt;}
@list l1:level7
{mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l1:level8
{mso-level-number-format:alpha-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l1:level9
{mso-level-number-format:roman-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:right;
text-indent:-9.0pt;}
@list l2
{mso-list-id:694699212;
mso-list-template-ids:-308243020;}
@list l2:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l2:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3
{mso-list-id:778915041;
mso-list-template-ids:739295400;}
@list l3:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l3:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4
{mso-list-id:803281145;
mso-list-template-ids:-1754783568;}
@list l4:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";
mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
@list l4:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l4:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:\F0B7;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l5
{mso-list-id:1081290607;
mso-list-type:hybrid;
mso-list-template-ids:1031698990 67698703 67698713 67698715 67698703 67698713 67698715 67698703 67698713 67698715;}
@list l5:level1
{mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l5:level2
{mso-level-number-format:alpha-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l5:level3
{mso-level-number-format:roman-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:right;
text-indent:-9.0pt;}
@list l5:level4
{mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l5:level5
{mso-level-number-format:alpha-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l5:level6
{mso-level-number-format:roman-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:right;
text-indent:-9.0pt;}
@list l5:level7
{mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l5:level8
{mso-level-number-format:alpha-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;}
@list l5:level9
{mso-level-number-format:roman-lower;
mso-level-tab-stop:none;
mso-level-number-position:right;
text-indent:-9.0pt;}
@list l6
{mso-list-id:1652902572;
mso-list-template-ids:-320025832;}
@list l6:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l6:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";
mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
@list l6:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l6:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l6:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l6:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l6:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l6:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l6:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l7
{mso-list-id:1986663152;
mso-list-template-ids:1400560324;}
@list l7:level1
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Symbol;}
@list l7:level2
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:o;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Courier New";
mso-bidi-font-family:"Times New Roman";}
@list l7:level3
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:1.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l7:level4
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l7:level5
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:2.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l7:level6
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l7:level7
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:3.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l7:level8
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.0in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
@list l7:level9
{mso-level-number-format:bullet;
mso-level-text:?;
mso-level-tab-stop:4.5in;
mso-level-number-position:left;
text-indent:-.25in;
mso-ansi-font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Wingdings;}
ol
{margin-bottom:0in;}
ul
{margin-bottom:0in;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
</head>
<body lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Jorje,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I agree with you that affinity should be supported. I am questioning whether a mandatory load balancer root object is the proper way.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I think that using mechanism such Nova’s hints for scheduling by optionally providing affinity hints is a better way.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">It looks like there are two different discussions here:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo11"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">A root object with IP properties (ipv4 and/or ipv6) with multiple listeners – As far as I understand the discussion is whether
such root object is called VIP or load-balancer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Does calling this object “load-balancer” is enough to address your needs?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo11"><![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">A root object that models a virtual load balancer instance that contains multiple different VIPs on which I have raised my
concerns.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">-Sam.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Jorge Miramontes [mailto:jorge.miramontes@RACKSPACE.COM]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, May 10, 2014 1:00 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [openstack-dev] [Neutron][LBaaS] API proposal review thoughts<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Sam, our larger customers especially care about affinity since they have many load balancer instances. Their use case usually centers around being re-sellers.
Also, if you have a deployment that utilizes several load balancers our customers have created tickets to ensure they are on different host machines so that they can mitigate host machine outages (we currently don't allow the tenant to choose affinity within
a cluster, only across DC's). In a nut shell, the use cases are relevant, especially to our larger customers/tenants (i.e. customers that we pay special attention to since they bring in the majority of revenue).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt;border-width:initial;border-color:initial">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#222222">Let me know if I am misunderstanding this,and please explain it</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">further.<br>
A single neutron port can have many fixed ips on many subnets. Since<br>
this is the case you're saying that there is no need for the API to<br>
define multiple VIPs since a single neutron port can represent all the<br>
IPs that all the VIPs require?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Right, if you want to to have both ipv4 and ipv6 addresses on the VIP then it's possible with single neutron port.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">So multiple VIPs for this case are not needed.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Eugene/Sam, a single Neutron port does allow for multiple subnets. However, this precludes tenants from having a load balancer that serves multiple networks.
An example use case is the following:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">"As a tenant I have several isolated private networks that were created to host different aspects of my business. They have been in use for a while. I also have
a new shared service (i.e. a database, wiki, etc.) that needs to be load balanced. I want each isolated private network to access the load balanced service."<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">As you can see this requires multiple vips. I can think of several other use cases but agree with others that even if multiple vips aren't needed (which they
are) a load balancer object is still needed for everything that Stephen presented.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">--Jorge<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">From:
</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black">Samuel Bercovici <<a href="mailto:SamuelB@Radware.com">SamuelB@Radware.com</a>><br>
<b>Reply-To: </b>"OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <<a href="mailto:openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org">openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Friday, May 9, 2014 3:37 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>"OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)" <<a href="mailto:openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org">openstack-dev@lists.openstack.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [openstack-dev] [Neutron][LBaaS] API proposal review thoughts<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #B5C4DF 4.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-right:0in" id="MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">It boils down to two aspects:</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">How common is it for tenant to care about affinity or have more than a single VIP used in a way that adding an additional (mandatory)
construct makes sense for them to handle?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">For example if 99% of users do not care about affinity or will only use a single VIP (with multiple listeners). In this case does adding an additional
object that tenants need to know about makes sense?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style="color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Scheduling this so that it can be handled efficiently by different vendors and SLAs. We can elaborate on this F2F next week.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.25in"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Can providers share their statistics to assist to understand how common are those use cases?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Regards,</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> -Sam.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black"> Stephen Balukoff [<a href="mailto:sbalukoff@bluebox.net">mailto:sbalukoff@bluebox.net</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 09, 2014 9:26 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [openstack-dev] [Neutron][LBaaS] API proposal review thoughts</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Hi Eugene,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">This assumes that 'VIP' is an entity that can contain both an IPv4 address and an IPv6 address. This is how it is in the API proposal and corresponding object model that I suggested, but it is a slight re-definition
of the term "virtual IP" as it's used in the rest of the industry. (And again, we're not yet in agreement that 'VIP' should actually contain two ip addresses like this.)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">In my mind, the main reasons I would like to see the container object are:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">It solves the colocation / apolcation (or affinity / anti-affinity) problem for VIPs in a way that is much more intuitive to understand and less confusing for users than either
the "hints" included in my API, or something based off the nova blueprint for doing the same for virtual servers/containers. (Full disclosure: There probably would still be a need for some anti-affinity logic at the logical load balancer level as well, though
at this point it would be an operator concern only and expressed to the user in the "flavor" of the logical load balancer object, and probably be associated with different billing strategies. "The user wants a dedicated physical load balancer? Then he should
create one with this flavor, and note that it costs this much more...")<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">From my experience, users are already familiar with the concept of what a logical load balancer actually is (ie. something that resembles a physical or virtual appliance from their
perspective). So this probably fits into their view of the world better.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">It makes sense for "Load Balancer as a Service" to hand out logical load balancer objects. I think this will aid in a more intuitive understanding of the service for users who otherwise
don't want to be concerned with operations.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">This opens up the option for private cloud operators / providers to bill based on number of physical load balancers used (if the "logical load balancer" happens to coincide with
physical load balancer appliances in their implementation) in a way that is going to be seen as "more fair" and "more predictable" to the user because the user has more control over it. And it seems to me this is accomplished without producing any undue burden
on public cloud providers, those who don't bill this way, or those for whom the "logical load balancer" doesn't coincide with physical load balancer appliances.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">Attaching a "flavor" attribute to a logical load balancer seems like a better idea than attaching it to the VIP. What if the user wants to change the flavor on which their VIP is
deployed (ie. without changing IP addresses)? What if they want to do this for several VIPs at once? I can definitely see this happening in our customer base through the lifecycle of many of our customers' applications.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">Having flavors associated with load balancers and not VIPs also allows for operators to provide a lot more differing product offerings to the user in a way that is simple for the
user to understand. For example:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level2 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">o</span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">"Flavor A" is the cheap load balancer option, deployed on a "shared"
platform used by many tenants that has fewer guarantees around performance and costs X.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level2 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">o</span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">"Flavor B" is guaranteed to be deployed on "vendor Q's Super Special
Product (tm)" but to keep down costs, may be shared with other tenants, though not among a single tenant's "load balancers" unless the tenant uses the same load balancer id when deploying their VIPs (ie. user has control of affinity among their own VIPs, but
no control over whether affinity happens with other tenants). It may experience variable performance as a result, but has higher guarantees than the above and costs a little more.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level2 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">o</span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">"Flavor C" is guaranteed to be deployed on "vendor P's Even Better
Super Special Product (tm)" and is also guaranteed not to be shared among tenants. This is essentially the "dedicated load balancer" option that gets you the best guaranteed performance, but costs a lot more than the above.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:1.0in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level2 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">o</span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">...and so on.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">A logical load balancer object is a great
<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demarcation_point">demarcation point </a> between operator concerns and user concerns. It seems likely that there will be an operator API created, and this will need to interface with the user API at some well-defined interface.
(If you like, I can provide a couple specific operator concerns which are much more easily accomplished without disrupting the user experience using the demarc at the 'load balancer' instead of at the 'VIP'.)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">So what are the main arguments against having this container object? In answering this question, please keep in mind:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l6 level1 lfo10">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">If you say "implementation details," please just go ahead and be more specific because that's what I'm going to ask you to do anyway. If "implementation details" is the concern,
please follow this with a hypothetical or concrete example as to what kinds of implementations this object would invalidate simply by existing in the model, or what restrictions this object introduces.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto;margin-left:.5in;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l6 level1 lfo10">
<![if !supportLists]><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Symbol;color:black"><span style="mso-list:Ignore">?<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir="LTR"></span><span style="color:black">If you say "I don't see a need" then you're really just asking people to come up with a use case that is more easily solved using the logical load balancer object rather than the
VIP without the load balancer. I hope my reasons above address this, but I'm happy to be more specific if you'd like: Please point out how my examples above are not convincing reasons for having this object, and I will be more specific.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Stephen<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">On Fri, May 9, 2014 at 1:36 AM, Eugene Nikanorov <<a href="mailto:enikanorov@mirantis.com" target="_blank">enikanorov@mirantis.com</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Hi Brandon<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#222222">Let me know if I am misunderstanding this,and please explain it</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">further.<br>
A single neutron port can have many fixed ips on many subnets. Since<br>
this is the case you're saying that there is no need for the API to<br>
define multiple VIPs since a single neutron port can represent all the<br>
IPs that all the VIPs require?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Right, if you want to to have both ipv4 and ipv6 addresses on the VIP then it's possible with single neutron port.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">So multiple VIPs for this case are not needed.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#888888">Eugene.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style="color:black"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
OpenStack-dev mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org">OpenStack-dev@lists.openstack.org</a><br>
<a href="http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev" target="_blank">http://lists.openstack.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/openstack-dev</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"><br>
<br clear="all">
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">-- <br>
Stephen Balukoff <br>
Blue Box Group, LLC <br>
(800)613-4305 x807 <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</body>
</html>