[openstack-dev] [Openstack-operators] Upstream LTS Releases
emccormick at cirrusseven.com
Wed Nov 15 00:25:09 UTC 2017
On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 4:10 PM, Rochelle Grober
<rochelle.grober at huawei.com> wrote:
> This discussion and the people interested in it seem like a perfect application of the SIG process. By turning LTS into a SIG, everyone can discuss the issues on the SIG mailing list and the discussion shouldn't end up split. If it turns into a project, great. If a solution is found that doesn't need a new project, great. Even once there is a decision on how to move forward, there will still be implementation issues and enhancements, so the SIG could very well be long-lived. But the important aspect of this is: keeping the discussion in a place where both devs and ops can follow the whole thing and act on recommendations.
> Food for thought.
Just to add more legs to the spider that is this thread: I think the
SIG idea is a good one. It may evolve into a project team some day,
but for now it's a free-for-all polluting 2 mailing lists, and
multiple etherpads. How do we go about creating one?
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Blair Bethwaite [mailto:blair.bethwaite at gmail.com]
>> Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2017 8:31 AM
>> To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)
>> <openstack-dev at lists.openstack.org>; openstack-oper. <openstack-
>> operators at lists.openstack.org>
>> Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] Upstream LTS Releases
>> Hi all - please note this conversation has been split variously across -dev and -
>> One small observation from the discussion so far is that it seems as though
>> there are two issues being discussed under the one banner:
>> 1) maintain old releases for longer
>> 2) do stable releases less frequently
>> It would be interesting to understand if the people who want longer
>> maintenance windows would be helped by #2.
>> On 14 November 2017 at 09:25, Doug Hellmann <doug at doughellmann.com>
>> > Excerpts from Bogdan Dobrelya's message of 2017-11-14 17:08:31 +0100:
>> >> >> The concept, in general, is to create a new set of cores from
>> >> >> these groups, and use 3rd party CI to validate patches. There are
>> >> >> lots of details to be worked out yet, but our amazing UC (User
>> >> >> Committee) will be begin working out the details.
>> >> >
>> >> > What is the most worrying is the exact "take over" process. Does it
>> >> > mean that the teams will give away the +2 power to a different
>> >> > team? Or will our (small) stable teams still be responsible for
>> >> > landing changes? If so, will they have to learn how to debug 3rd party CI
>> >> >
>> >> > Generally, I'm scared of both overloading the teams and losing the
>> >> > control over quality at the same time :) Probably the final proposal will
>> clarify it..
>> >> The quality of backported fixes is expected to be a direct (and
>> >> only?) interest of those new teams of new cores, coming from users
>> >> and operators and vendors. The more parties to establish their 3rd
>> >> party
>> > We have an unhealthy focus on "3rd party" jobs in this discussion. We
>> > should not assume that they are needed or will be present. They may
>> > be, but we shouldn't build policy around the assumption that they
>> > will. Why would we have third-party jobs on an old branch that we
>> > don't have on master, for instance?
>> >> checking jobs, the better proposed changes communicated, which
>> >> directly affects the quality in the end. I also suppose, contributors
>> >> from ops world will likely be only struggling to see things getting
>> >> fixed, and not new features adopted by legacy deployments they're used
>> to maintain.
>> >> So in theory, this works and as a mainstream developer and
>> >> maintainer, you need no to fear of losing control over LTS code :)
>> >> Another question is how to not block all on each over, and not push
>> >> contributors away when things are getting awry, jobs failing and
>> >> merging is blocked for a long time, or there is no consensus reached
>> >> in a code review. I propose the LTS policy to enforce CI jobs be
>> >> non-voting, as a first step on that way, and giving every LTS team
>> >> member a core rights maybe? Not sure if that works though.
>> > I'm not sure what change you're proposing for CI jobs and their voting
>> > status. Do you mean we should make the jobs non-voting as soon as the
>> > branch passes out of the stable support period?
>> > Regarding the review team, anyone on the review team for a branch that
>> > goes out of stable support will need to have +2 rights in that branch.
>> > Otherwise there's no point in saying that they're maintaining the
>> > branch.
>> > Doug
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