[openstack-dev] Split of the openstack-dev list (summary so far)

Thierry Carrez thierry at openstack.org
Fri Nov 15 17:08:35 UTC 2013

Adrian Otto wrote:
> If OpenStack starts a culture of exclusion instead of inclusion, that would start a dangerous trend that sets the wrong tone. It would quickly reach the point where new projects like mine would simply not come here. We would go somewhere else that does have a culture of inclusion. We would not employ the values of open design and open collaboration, and we would be back to the "throw stuff over the wall" approach to open source. That would be a tragedy. Don't destroy the things about OpenStack's community that make it awesome.

It's definitely a trade-off between usability and community inclusion...
Trust me, I understand the value of cross-pollination, which is why I
wouldn't support a pure per-project split (as suggested elsewhere in
this thread). I'm just trying to find the right balance.

>> Because they ARE two different groups.
> That thinking is backwards. From a community perspective we are not two different groups. Making us into two groups is a huge mistake.

I was talking about groups of projects. We have an incubation process to
decide when new projects are allowed to start tapping into OpenStack
common resources, like use an openstack/* repo, get into the integrated
gate, or tap into QA or release management dudes for guidance. I see
openstack-dev ML space as one of those common resources. Letting anyone
use it to talk about their new stackforge project has some cost, even if
it's an externality to you.

This is not about excluding anyone, it's about prioritizing our
resources. If we followed your line of thought, we should just abandon
the project incubation process because it's a way to prevent promising
projects from accessing resources they need in order to develop their
full potential.

Anyway, I don't expect to convince you, since you're clearly the one
benefiting the most from the current setup. I'm on the other end of the
spectrum, trying my best to keep my sanity with the ever-growing number
of things I need to keep an eye on :) And maybe the benefits of
unlimited cross-pollination are worth more than the drawback of forcing
everyone to process enormous email piles every day. (Filtering is an
option I have with well-behaved projects like Solum, I just fear it
would not work so well for less "filterable" threads.)

Thierry Carrez (ttx)

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