[openstack-dev] Split of the openstack-dev list

Clint Byrum clint at fewbar.com
Thu Nov 14 19:46:46 UTC 2013

Excerpts from Thierry Carrez's message of 2013-11-14 05:12:55 -0800:
> Hi everyone,
> I think that we have recently reached critical mass for the
> openstack-dev mailing-list, with 2267 messages posted in October, and
> November well on its way to pass 2000 again. Some of those are just
> off-topic (and I've been regularly fighting against them) but most of
> them are just about us covering an ever-increasing scope, stretching the
> definition of what we include in "openstack development".
> Therefore I'd like to propose a split between two lists:
> *openstack-dev*: Discussions on future development for OpenStack
> official projects
> *stackforge-dev*: Discussions on development for stackforge-hosted projects
> Non-official "OpenStack-related" projects would get discussed in
> stackforge-dev (or any other list of their preference), while
> openstack-dev would be focused on openstack official programs (including
> incubated & integrated projects).
> That means discussion about Solum, Mistral, Congress or Murano
> (stackforge/* repos in gerrit) would now live on stackforge-dev.
> Discussions about Glance, TripleO or Oslo libraries (openstack*/* repos
> on gerrit) would happen on openstack-dev. This will allow easier
> filtering and prioritization; OpenStack developers interested in
> tracking promising stackforge projects would subscribe to both lists.
> That will not solve all issues. We should also collectively make sure
> that *usage questions are re-routed* to the openstack general
> mailing-list, where they belong. Too many people still answer off-topic
> questions here on openstack-dev, which encourages people to be off-topic
> in the future (traffic on the openstack general ML has been mostly
> stable, with only 868 posts in October). With those actions, I hope that
> traffic on openstack-dev would drop back to the 1000-1500 range, which
> would be more manageable for everyone.

Allow me an analogy if you will:

Consider a burgeoning city. There are people who have been around a long
time. Some are politicians, some work for the city, some are just good
citizens. These people see newcomers in the commons and greet them with
open arms. Those who have only been around a while see those and see that
this is a city where new people are welcome, and they do the same as the
old timers, welcoming new residents and visitors alike, and they also
feel even more welcome than before they noticed that. Though newcomers
must wait a while and gain the trust of the old-timers to call themselves
citizens, they are already encouraged to participate in discussions at
every level and to organize themselves in the same way as the old-timers.

Now consider a different city. Things are quiet in the commons. Newcomers
are greeted with a sign. "Newcomers over there->". That part of town is
unknown to the rest of the world. It has less infrastructure. It also
has very little representation in the government. The line is very clear
between the citizens and the newcomers. When the newcomers want to become
full citizens, they have to go before a council of old-timers, some of
whom have specifically decided to ignore newcomers until this moment.

Now, choose which city will grow faster and produce more innovation.

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